Lesbian films/vids/scenes

[sweatyfox]

Hey Catwoman and everyone

Yes a thread where anyone (not just me and Catwoman) can discuss good lesbian movies, videos, scenes they have seen elsewhere, so we can leave the other threads to discuss the AW g/g shoots and videos they are supposed to be about.

To start off I would however like to ask the lovely Catwoman or even sexy Sara G whether any of the following Sapphic films and scenes has been enjoyable for them:

1 Angelina Jolie and friend (Gia)
2 Chloe Sevigny and Michelle Williams (If These Walls Could Talk 2)
3 Gina Gershon and Meg Tilly (Bound)
4 Anne Heche and Joan Chen? : which movie was this in again?

Or any other times when an US indie movie or cable movie has really got it right!

SF

[catwoman]

Hi SF (and others too.)

I've seen all the movies that you mentioned. The last with Anne Heche and the sexy Joan Chen is "Wild Side". There are actually two versions of that movie floating about. One is slightly longer and more explicit, so you need to pay attention to which one you rent/view. A little bit too much for me with the het rape scene, but otherwise ok. The acting was over the top, exp. by Chistopher Walken. (As an aside, see Joan Chen in another movie with a small lesbian subplot, "What's Cooking", where she plays a mom (not a lesbian), and you won't believe that it is the same woman.)

Gia is a terrific movie, but of course not very uplifting. Better to follow watching that one with something a little more "happy".

I enjoyed the set up in Bound and the feel of the entire movie. It is one of my favorite fun movies. One of those movies that whether you like your women butch or femme you'll have someone to drool after. (Originally they wanted Tilly to play the butch and she asked to play the femme role. Now that would have been some miscasting.)

Chloe Sevigny and Michelle William in "It These Walls Could Talk 2" very well done. I have heard some critism from older lesbians that it was not "historically" accurate about lesbian culture at the time, but I wouldn't know as it was before my time.) Personally, I think that Chloe Sevigny is soooo sexy, that I really did 't care if it was "accurate" or not.

For coming out movies, my favorite is "All Over Me". (It is only available in video and is very well done. The same women responsable for the CS and MW piece in "If These..." are responsible for this movie as well.) An oldie that I like is "Desert Hearts" since it is a nice love story, well acted, nice love scenes with a real plot. Though it has a much slimmer plot and is very predicable, I also like "When Night is Falling". Very sweet with great looking leads. (Of course, SF, it begins with Pascale Bussiers, swimming nude in the water under ice interacting with another woman. Well, you know my water thing...)

There are alot of good shorts and compliations out there too. Also movies with different set ups, BDSM world ("Mercy"); Indian culture; ("Chutney Popcorn" and "Fire"). SF, if you have an interest in a particular movie or type of set up in an R type movie, let me know. I tend to stay current on the topic as it is a bit of a hobby of mine.

[sweatyfox]

Thanks Catwoman, I knew I could turn to you as a veritable font of knowledge on the subject. I will get round to letting you know about particular set ups or interests I like, I could do with some recommendations for R/softer movies. As I said before I like a little of both R and more explicit X, just depends on my mood really. I'm always a sucker for a good story with nicely shot and believable scenes and a lot of affection and tenderness, just as much as some more explicit, steamy, wet action!

I think here in the UK that nowadays when 2 versions are released in the US (R and Unrated), we tend to get the full uncut or unrated version. In most cases anyway, so I would imagine I can see "Wild Side" in all its glory. Not so many hang ups about more steamy scenes in movies here! We also of course get a lot of European indie or arthouse movies. I think I saw "Fire" in a high street music store the other day.

I seem to remember being in the States and seeing some movie "The Truth About Jane" on Lifetime cable channel. Also a show on ABC that got cancelled, either "Now and Again" or "Once and Again"? It had one story line where the daughter, (played by spunky Evan Rachel Wood), had feelings for one of her female friends. Stupid TV network cancelling it, ratings chasing executives, oh well. I think it's a shame you have to go to cable networks to see better bi/lesbian female characters, it seems gay male characters are better represented on network shows than female ones. Also I don't imagine so many of these US indie movies, lesbian themed, open on so many screens in the Midwest or South, only in big cities.

SF

[catwoman]

Yes, I know that other parts of the world don't have the hang-ups about sex and nudity that censors do in the US. You wouldn't believe how they cut "Tipping the Velvet" on BBC America. A friend got a tape of what was on the tv in the UK and the difference was shocking. (It will probably be another 20 years before the censors will let a dildo be seen on US tv.) There is also a difference between the love scene in the "When Night is Falling" from Canada DVD and the US version vhs and the version shown on cable tv. The DVD has an extented love scene which is much sweeter.

Any time there is even a same sex kiss the parental warnings go up. Even the cable networks like HBO who proport to show the full movie, don't always. (You can filet someone with a knife on tv but kiss them, omg!!) The difference in the sex scenes in "Mercy" DVD and what they showed on HBO were very significant. Mind you "Mercy" was rated "R" so they really shouldn't have cut any of the movie.

I know the tv shows that you are speaking of. And have seen the "The Truth About Jane", which was a pretty good made for tv movie. Lifetime is very good showing lgbt themed movies such as "Love Makes A Family" about a lesbian fighting for custody of a child vs. the bio moms parents. There are several shows with lesbian characters, ER comes to mind first. My g/f likes the soap, "All My Children" which has had a lesbian story in the forefront for awhile. The new "L-Word" on Showtime looks promising, but I don't get bonus cable. (As for "Fire" a very nice movie with insight into Indian culture. The women in the movie are extremely beautiful.)

We are lucky that the city I live in has an independent theatre, so we get to see most of the glbt themed movies. Also, our cable company doesn't not show some series on non-cable stations with a glbt theme, like they do in some stations (esp. the south) across the US.

You're right that the US networks have alot more gay men than women. Problem is that they usually reduce the men to such stereotypes. I guess that camp is alot less threatening to the general US public in the heartland.

[Abby]

OO! OO! "Bound" is one of my faves. http://www.abbywinters.com/discus/clipart/happy.gif

abby

[catwoman]

If you like Bound, be sure to listen to the director's narration on the DVD. Susie Bright provides the commentary along with the Wachowski Brothers. She manages to raise the level of conversation so that you find out neat things about the movie, such as the pipe scene being a metaphor for fisting or loading up the Watering Hole bar with actual lesbians instead of your regular Hollywood extras.

[nursefan]

My favourite lesbian film is "Lianna" (1983) directed by John Sayles and starring Linda Griffiths. Some very erotic stuff in it.

[catwoman]

I had an ancient copy of Lianna on VHS and was happy when it recently come out on DVD. It's one of my favorite movies too and yes, very erotic. I like John Sayles films esp. the fact that he uses actors that look like real people. Enjoyed the relationship that Lianna has with her friend, Sandy in the film. I remember when the movie came out that there was alot of hostility amoung some radical lesbians that a "man" had made the movie--I think that they were just jealous--and specifically the scene where Lianna walks down the street noticing all the pretty women walking by, calling it very unrealistic. On the contrary, I thought the movie very representative of the time and thought the Lianna's awakening to the beauty of women she passed in the street very realistic. What's the point of being a lesbian if you can appreciate the women you see?

[nursefan]

Yes Catwoman, great to meet another John Sayles fan. I thought it looked realistic too, I didn't realise there was a debate over it.

Have you ever seen a film called "Go Fish", not John Sayles work, but another film giving a realistic view of lesbian life. How realistic do you think it was?

[sara_g]

God, i feel like so lame. I havent seen
any of the movies you mentioned. Ive not
really been "practicing" with my attraction
to other girls for very long . . . only a
couple of years.

You are all giving me a good education. lol.

hugs, sara

[catwoman]

Yes, I've seen "Go, Fish". I think that it gives a very realistic view of a specific group of lesbians in a moment in time. I think that there can be no one definitive movie on "lesbian life" as the lesbian community includes radical dykes, soccer moms in the subs, punk grrls, lipstick lesbians, and on, and on. That, being said, I think that the view in "Go, Fish" was quite refreshing given the mainstream media's need to often heterosexualize lesbians and lesbian lives. Not a great movie, but not bad for a low budget experimental film with unpaid talent. Anyway, I've always liked the film's message that there is someone out there for everyone, you just have to keep looking and drop all your preconceived notions.

Lianna did generate some debate, as I said, with the more radical women. I remember that the film was esp. treated harshless in the publication, "Off Our Backs". Not to be confused with the lesbian erotic mag., "On Our Backs", who humorously "took" their name from the more radically feminist publication

[catwoman]

Well, Sara G, you now have a few titles to get you started on a practice session. Let us know what type of movies you like, and I am sure that someone can point you in the right direction for good films.

[sweatyfox]

Hiya Catwoman

Well I have thought about the first category of story I like. 1) It is the kind of young girl coming out, where she has difficulty perhaps with friends' or family's acceptance. Whether at school or college or just in a small town etc. Also the kind of story where the attraction is obviously there but neither acknowledges it for a while or does anything about it initially.

2)Another is the young girl (like the models on this site) being attracted to a more mature lady (eg the soccer moms you've mentioned etc) or vice versa (hopefully mutual attraction).

3)I guess one more would be either attraction across different ethnicity/'race' between two girls. Or a film/movie about lesbian attraction in a culture where it is not thought of as being common or is frowned upon by some. I know you mentioned above some 'Indian culture' movies, kinda along those lines.

Well anyway you know I prefer a happy ending (especially in scenario 1) but it doesn't have to be. I do like a realistic portrait and if the ending isn't so happy I guess it is a message perhaps something needs to be done or changed. Also it would be nice if there is a genuinely erotic or steamy sex scene, though that isn't a prerequisite. I guess I am sucker for a movie which takes you through the range of emotions, almost along with the characters. (Laughter, crying, tenderness, humour, passion etc)

SF

[catwoman]

These are some movies off the top of my head. All very different types of movies from different countries, so one might strike your fancy.

1>For the coming out stories, my favorite, which I have mentioned above is "All Over Me". Others would include "True About Jane" "TV Movie"; "Show Me Love", and "Oranges Are Not the Only Fruit". All very different types of movies from different countries, so one might strike your fancy.

2> older/younger: "Maedchen in Uniform" (1931 - German with subtitles)
"High Art" *
" I've Heard the Mermaids Singing"*
"Desert Hearts"
"Lianna"

3> cross cultural: "A Family Affair" (WASP/Jewish)comedy
"Churney Popcorn" (Indian/American)
"Incredibly True Adventures of Two Girls in Love"
"When Night is Falling" (Christian conflict)

*Both of these have photography as the occupation of one of the lead characters. "I've Heard the Mermaids Singing" is more about the lead character's infatuation with the older "curator".

[sara_g]

Hi Catwoman,

Yes, I do have a nice start on titles. Can't rily
order any even tho i'd like to. But, you do sound
like you know a bunch. Read what you said about your
gf. Its very sweet.

hugs, sara

[angelus]

Oranges Are Not the Only Fruit was one of the BBC's great mini drama's, the conflict of growing up in a strict religious family, the BBC really needs to get this out on DVD. Marmalade Atkins, I mean Charlotte Coleman was superb in the lead role, I still can't believe she died.

[Vid Dude]

[B]Marmalade Atkins, I mean Charlotte Coleman was superb in the lead role, I still can't believe she died. My sentiments exactly, to the letter, every time I remember her. I was a fan of hers as far back as Worzel Gummidge.

*bad girl warning* *bad girl warning*

[angelus]

Hehe, nice one. Charlotte was a great actress and is the only reason I managed to watch Four Weddings. I believe it was seeing Charlotte in Worzel Gummidge and Marmalade Atkin's as a kid which gave me weakness for red heads, at least there's still Willow, Alyson Hannigan.

[catwoman]

Oranges is out in DVD, R2, so it can be played on Region 2 or multi-region DVD players.

Like you, Angelus, Charlotte Coleman what got me thru Four Weddings. Just loved her spirit in Oranges. What a sweetheart.

[catwoman]

Hi Sara G: I've mentioned this before on the site, but you are new so I thought that I'd mention this to you. (For those who have heard before, my apologies.) Go to www.planetout.com and check out their popcorn cinema. They have plenty of free movies you can watch online. That's a nice savings on the pocketbook. Alot of the shorts wind up later on compliation DVDs.

[angelus]

Cheers Catwoman, I've just checked out play.com and it's out on a Region 0 format, have no idea how that one got past me, now where's my card.

[sweatyfox]

I have to see Oranges again! I was quite young when it was last on TV. I do remember it being good and pretty hot. Quite wrenching as well. But that's about all I clearly remember. So that's one to check out.

Otherwise thanks Catwoman, plenty for me there. You are brilliant. How I have to look at getting that DVD player. You Americans are really lucky, I saw there were players going for around 30 dollars on Thanksgiving weekend shopping.

SF

[bobby]

Hi,

I dont know if a male voice here is out of place here? By definition I am a voyeur when it comes to lesbianism. I have no idea why they are so infinitely more interesting to me than b/g movies. I can only repeat that the GIL movie, towards the end when they look into each others eyes is the best I have seen in the genre, but I am not an expert. In a way its sort of a "dead-end" for a man to become interested in lesbian art. But personally, I have been denying that side of me for a long time. Not that I am proud of it, but seems to be hard to deny. Anyway, to see, and get close to two girls in love, is for me the ultimate. Even if I am forever banned from the Garden of Eden myself...

Rob

[sweatyfox]

Hi Bobby

No way is a male voice out of place on this thread, its all inclusive. I'm sure we appreciate many of the same things about girls and the art of Sapphic Love as the lovely ladies Catwoman and Sara G. And there's no better place to come for recommendations than from the people in the know. Yes we cannot experience lesbian love for ourselves but I think two girls together in love, or even just strong lust, must be one of the additional wonders of the world.

I know what you mean about the Garden of Eden but hopefully we will get to party together somewhere else : with Abby, Jamie, Sara G, Catwoman, Viddude, Roops, Arsby, Mrs Roops, Angelus, TFL, Dafydd, Arsby, Ratty, Cass, Jus1drun and all the other great members here and some of the models too. I'm looking forward to a big orgy myself. Lots of jollyness, laughter, kinkyness and lesbianism at this party.

SF

[sweatyfox]

PS Bobby I started another thread about what is good and not so good in lesbian vids of the type here at AW.com (more explicit), so I'd be interested in your ideas. This discussion here is kind of more about good mainstream/indie/foreign films and even I guess literature. I'm also interested in how it permeates into cultures and wider society, hence why I asked Catwoman aobut censorship, availability of these films in the US, etc.

It would also be good to know also what people like in terms of the more raunchy/steamy stuff, so check it out, I put my other thread in this section also!

SF

[nursefan]

One male voice missing is my good friend ARDSFC, an authority on lesbian movie scenes.

There's a good one in a film Called "Strangers" staring Cherie Lungie, where she has her wicked way with a young French girl! Suit her sir!!

[catwoman]

Nursefan, Are you refering to the TV show, "Strangers" or was there a movie with the same name? I enjoy Cherie Lungie and remember her fondly from an appearance on Midsommer Murders.

SF: Just curious, what do DVD players go for in the UK? (You are right about the $30 DVD players. I got my parents one so they can look at the movies that my sister's girls make for them. The DVD/VHS combo is going for about $90.)

[spinner]

Rob, I'm a het boy from the U.S. who watches plenty of lesbian films. Go Fish is one that stands out in my mind because of one particular scene in which Max (Is it Max? I forget if it's her or someone else) is confronted by a crowd of grrrls who are divided on whether she should have her lesbian license revoked because she slept with a boy. It's a powerful scene and resonates across cultures, preferences, races. It's the question of if you deviate from the norms of a group, do you still belong in that group, even if your deviation feels large in scope.

I don't know if you have to define yourself as a voyeur if you're attaching any negativity to it. For me, lesbian films are interesting for lots of reasons; you probably don't have to suffer through ridiculous one-liners spoken by buff brainless types, the issues are often more real and resonate with "a day in the life of anybody," etc. If they wrote better male/female dialogue, I'd be more interested in movies with male/female relationships. So much of the Hollywood junk leaves plenty to be desired though. I think the Brits out there have it much better. The BBC seems to do a much better job with made for T.V. programming. Essentially though, I prefer listening/watching/talking to women. I have close male friends but not nearly as many as female friends. So, maybe you just know that you have an appreciation for women that most men wouldn't have.

As far as sex or porn is concerned, if it turns me on, I don't care what it is. If it turns me off, I won't view it and it doesn't really matter who's doing what to whom. It's WHAT they're doing and how they are doing it that affects me.
My girlfriend and I will watch a porn video together and she's more curious about why the women are making the video. Somehow, if she likes the woman on the video, she gets turned on herself. The men in the videos if there are any, don't even enter her consciousness.

For me, seeing any couple in love is fun to watch but I do love the g/g sets here on AW or some of the scenes in movies mentioned above. Seeing people in love brings a smile to my face. The world seems so much better when people are laughing...
I think it should be okay for you to see two girls in love as the ultimate. It's interesting though. After all, it's a preference just like pretty much everything is a preference.

spinner

[spinner]

[B]I know what you mean about the Garden of Eden but hopefully we will get to party together somewhere else : with [et al]. I'm looking forward to a big orgy myself. Lots of jollyness, laughter, kinkyness and lesbianism at this party.

SF

well spoken SF. that'd be a great party.

spinner

[zalani]

One of the best ever videos of the younger/older theme and a schoolgirl's
awakening to love, which is of course the wonderful movie called "Bilitis" by David Hamilton

Another video of note is the "Berlin Affair" under the cross culture theme staring Gudrun Landgrebe and Mio Takaki. Very erotic scenes with Louise and Mitsuko and the kissing is passionate and sweet.

zee

[sweatyfox]

Hey Catwoman

The cheaper ones I've seen are around £99, plus umpteen DVDs free. I personally would like a multi-region one or one that can play PAL and NTSC! More choice that way.

I think there must be some good lesbian bookshops here in London. Trouble is they'd be the easiest place to find some of these films but how do I as a man go in and explain that I truly am interested, without a load of sniggering/laughter and the like? Oh well there are always the music stores. I just wish I didn't have to feel uncomfortable going in somewhere as though I don't belong there or have no business entering.

SF

[catwoman]

Hi Zee: God, Bilitis. That's an old one. I saw "Bilitis" at a film festival many many years ago. Do remember the young/older woman theme, but not much else. I'll have to check that out again.

I have enjoyed several of the German made lesbian movies out there, so I have seen clips of a "Berlin Affair" on several sites. It is one of those oldies that is real hard to come by.

[catwoman]

Hi SF:

Probably after the holidays, the price of the DVD players will come down.

If you are looking for DVDs to purchase, consider looking on e-bay and on-line shops. I've had good luck that way, esp. on e-bay. It's easier to compare prices on-line.

Don't worry about going into a women's bookstore to make a purchase. Money is money and I'm sure that you'd charm the proprietresses would find you delightful.

[nursefan]

You are right Catwoman, "Strangers" was a TV show, there are some stills on Robb's Celebs:

Cherie Lunghi (http://members.fortunecity.com/oops66/oops_cherie_lunghi163.html)

[sweatyfox]

Oh yes Nursefan. Robb's Celebs is a great site for celeb nudes, from your A-List Film star to a TV series. And a British site as well!? Robb is obviously a genius, though not quite as talented as Abby here.

SF

[angelus]

Hey SF, just a note about DVD players here in the UK, there are a few under £50 in places like woolies and argos, but it worth saving up and purchasing a player which is chipped to play all regions, an essential requirement IMHO. The other good thing for us is that because we run on the PAL system we have no problems with playing NTSC disks.

Robb's Celebs site is quite a fun site, but more of the top publications and their lawyers are starting to make the site remove photo's. The best concept of the site is that it is free unlike other so-called celeb sites, but it wouldn't work if people didn't submit the material.

[catwoman]

Nursefan: Thanks for the link to Robb's Celebs. A very interesting site with a wide range of photos. It will be fun exploring.

[sweatyfox]

Catwoman, I think you will enjoy Robb's site. Yeah, he has the usual suspects "ooh look there's Britney's nipple almost slipping out". But also some good screencaps and photos from steamy lesbian scenes, nice to see a lot of European actresses in there and the like. Think Angelina Jolie from Gia is there as well. I particularly like some of the French actresses he has in there.

I just remembered when I mentioned the TV series 'Once and Again' that I think the other actress that Evan Rachel Wood (the daughter) was attracted to was Mischa Barton from Lost and Delerious! I mentioned this cos that new movie about troubled teens with Wood, Nikki Reed and Holly Hunter just opened here in the UK today.

SF

[sweatyfox]

Oh and thanks Angelus, I saw there have been a few cheap ones going here for 30 quid but I think you're right, I'd like the multi region kind.

Catwoman, what do you think of the ELMS site? I see it has screencaps from lots of lesbian films or programmes. A-list, Indie movies, European movies, TV series, even the B Movies on Cinemax etc. Like RC but for just lesbian scenes. Nice girls kissing section and some screencaps from one company's more X-Rated stuff.

I just wondered, I saw they were thinking of putting some screencaps up from one of the Brazilian Amateurs vids. Seeing as they say they get over a million hits? I wondered Abby if it is worth giving em a few screencaps from one of your fantastic DVDs. Its just a thought from me whilst in promotional mood. Maybe not. It seems a good site anyway, even if it is concentrating mostly on the kissing, naked and sex aspects of movies.

SF

[catwoman]

SF:

I do check out the ELMS site periodically and like the movie section. The kissing section is also fun and I am always glad when they update with new pictures. I enjoy tvandfilmgrrl more--even though it is less extensive--because the woman who runs the site gives more backround and information on the tv shows and films rather than just some pictures or clips. Alot of women also write info and send pictures for the site for the webmistress to post. They also sometimes post interesting magazine articles and advertisements. The women only list for that group is also full of information and clips and photos of lesbian interest. Some of the GLBT sites also carry clips and info on new film/tv so I link to a few of those posts also.

You are correct that Evan Rachel Wood and Mischa Barton were the teens involved in the lesbian theme on Once and Again. You'll like the Holly Hunter film, "Thirteen". Although, once you see it you may never want to have any children of your own! http://www.abbywinters.com/discus/clipart/happy.gif

[nursefan]

Hey CatWoman! I can't thank you enough for that TVANDFILMGRRL.COM site (tvandfilmgrrl.com) I will have much fun navigating it. Cheers!!!!

[sweatyfox]

Yes, brilliant stuff Catwoman. Some of my fav shows on there as well. I liked Boomtown and Once and Again for that storyline. Both cancelled. Oh well. Home and Away, the Aussie soap has had its share of storylines, bout time for some Sapphic activity in Neighbours no?

Well anyway a good resources and as you say Catwoman it is more informed and detailed about each program/film and the story. Also gives release dates etc, nice. I enjoyed watching the Once and Again clip. I think its great that some of these young actresses are getting involved in such storylines. Mischa Barton, Chloe Sevigny, Evan Rachel Wood, Clea DuVall have all done some good work. I hope they are helping other young girls at the same time who are confronting their sexuality.

I like how in a lot of these movies, the girls aren't supermodels or all glam. Many of them (eg in Foxfire) are just nice looking sweet young girls, almost like the ones here!

[catwoman]

(For folks without all region dvd players) The complete DVD--not the edited version that appeared on BBC America or in DVD's previously released in region 1-- for "Tipping the Velvet" will be released in 1/04 for region 1. It's already been released in other regions.

[sweatyfox]

Hey Catwoman

The BBC in their wisdom repeated all 3 episodes of Tipping The Velvet in one night over the holidays. Great! I got to follow it all the way through without the tabloid furore which came with it the first time around. And aren't the love interests really sexy women, especially the maid and the girl Nan gets with in episode 3. Jodhi May? I should have recognised her beauty from that scene in Last of the Mohicans. Anyway more than enough evidence we have some lovely actresses here in the U of K don't you think?

SF

[nursefan]

tvandfilmgrrl.com has been taken down, what a shame!

[catwoman]

SF: Yes, some lovely women in the U.K...but then, I think there are lovely women to be had on every continent.

I remember watching "Nan's"/Rachel's mom, Diana Rigg, on old Avengers reruns when I was a kid. I think that is where my penchant for women in leather was developed. :) Mother and daughter look quite similar around the eyes.

Did you read the book as well? The characters are more developed in the book and you understand Nan's decision at then end more clearly in the book.

Nursefan: Some good news on the horizon for tvandfilmgrrl.com is that some other women with web experience have offered to take over the site. We'll have to see if Sarah takes them off on their offer. You may want to check out afterellen.com in the meantime. Not the same sort of site, but interesting pieces from time to time.

[sweatyfox]

Hi Catwoman

I agree there are some lovely women all over the world. I thought the love interests in Tipping The Velvet were well chosen though. I'll have to get on to the book as I was wondering about the reasons for the decision. I think it was right though.

I'm just curious as to how they censored this on BBC America? I mean there isn't sex all over the place in it but mucking about with these scenes surely ruins some of the eroticism. Did they blur or just cut it? Is the US DVD the same?

Lets hope tvandfilmgrrl gets back soon, shame to be turned on to a good site by you Catwoman, only to see it go down for a while.

SF

[catwoman]

SF:

Actually, S. Waters disagreed with the choices for the leads. She thought the actors were too attractive and Nan, esp., not believable as passing as a boy. However, in the book, Waters really doesn't go into much of a discription of any of her characters' appearances. Once you see the movie, the characters in the movie become the visuals for the characters in the book. At any rate, I think the attractiveness of the actors was more a marketing decision then anything else and I won't complain about that!

Most of the women I know feel in love with Kitty in the movie. However, always the exception, I just love Rachel Sterling and was quite happy with her as Nan (swoon).

The cuts to the BBC America version were quite extreme. Several of the sex scenes were cut out, as were any naked breast "scenes", the dildo and several other important scenes that set the stage to explain Nan's choice of Flo at the movie's end. Interesting enough for a production entitled "Tipping the Velvet" any depiction of oral sex (between Kitty and Nan, Nan and Zena or Nan explaining to Flo the expression) were eliminated from the movie. There were several folks at work who saw the movie and didn't even understand that tipping the velvet was slang for cunnilingus. Production seen in the U.K. and the production seen on BBC America were not in the same league.

There was a previous released dvd/vhs in the US that was the BBC America version. The dvd that is being released in the region this month is the unedited BBC version.

See in America, they'll show someone being decapitated, raped, beaten or ______ (fill in the most violent act you can think of) but won't show two women kissing in a romantic setting without about 100 parental warnings flashing on the screen and in the t.v. guide. It's a very strange place to say the least.

[sweatyfox]

I hear you Catwoman and I totally agree with you, they have their priorities all mixed up, I am really sorry that we had to send you all those religious nutters, puritans from our shores back in the day, but can't you see why we kicked them out of this fair isle. I mean burning women who were suspected 'witches' and the like. You must have realised they were a bit bonkers. However their legacy lives on thanks to fine upstanding citizens like Mr Patrick Roberston and Mr Jerry Falwell. Fancy being more scared of lesbians than axe wielding chainsaw massicarists!

I saw they are even trying to ban the 'F' word from TV and Radio in the states. In the daytime fair enough but at night? I just hate the way they think they can regulate it for adults as well as children (the latter is more understandable!).

Anyway Tipping The Velvet was originally shown at 9pm on BBC2 with scenes intact including dildo and nudity. When it came out it was rated '15' on video, I think that our film board has finally cottoned on to the fact that most Brits are far more concerned about the level of violence in films etc. Its a pity about the US attitude, cos a film like Y Tu Mama Tambien is a very uplifting and moving story but would last about 5 minutes on US Network TV. Thanks goodness for free speech and the unrated version eh! I see Bertolucci's "The Dreamers" got an NC-17. Although it is still a stupid attitude, those Amercians fortunate enough to live near an arthouse cinema in a big metropolis will be able to see it uncut as it was meant to be seen.

SF

[catwoman]

SF:

Yes, as a lesbian, the feeling of fear that you can strike in the hearts of grown men like Pat Robinson and Jerry Falwell can be overwhelming. Imagine being partially "responsible" for the 9/11 attack on the World Trade Center. Now that' s power.

As far as free speech, the U.S. likes to pretend that we have that (not!).
I enjoy watching a familiar movie on tv just to see WHAT the censors have cut out and missed entirely. I

As an aside...
Family on my mother's side came to the U.S. as part of a family trapeze act traveling with a circus.(Truely.) My father's family came here after my grandfather stole his father's donkey and sold if for cash. Great-grand father beat the crap out of him and grandfather decided to immigrate to the U.S. where he loved drinking and gambling. (Also true.) We are still a pretty fun bunch.

[catwoman]

FYI: Reviews and notices of new and upcoming l/b releases on dvd, theatre, and print just posted to http:// www.outtakes.net

[nursefan]

Catwoman, you are a mine of information. That outtakes.net site looks very interesting, especially the film reviews. Have you seen them all?

[catwoman]

Nursefan: I'm signed onto the outtakes site as a member so whenever any new items are posted, I go and check them out. If you are not a member, I'd recommend that you join just for the update info.

At this point, I've read probably every review on the site. I've seen the vast majority of R films that appears on their site in theatre or vid. The most difficult to view are the independent foreign films that don't make it to dvd or ever are shown widely in the US, but every once in a while someone has a vhs copy of these as well. From www. planetout.com I've been able to seen some of the shorts as well. Currently, at the Sundance Film festival several lgbt films are being shown. It will be interesting to see the response they get to allow wider distribution.

[catwoman]

Should have mentioned that you can view the current sundance film festival films or the park festival films online at http://www.sundanceonlinefilmfestival.org/ for $10. Shorts can be viewed at www.sundance.com .

Two non-documentary type films that might be of interest are:


"D.E.B.S."
Sure to be the biggest lesbian feature of the year, look for Angela Robinson's lesbian action film in malls across America this summer (based on the short "D.E.B.S.," winner of the Grand Prize in the 2003 PlanetOut.com Short Movie Awards). You can see the short of D.E.B.S. from which the greenlight was given for the movie, on www.planetout.com .

"Haute Tension"
A pair of sexy lesbian college girls headline this gory French thriller.
We're expecting something like "Bound" meets "Heavenly Creatures."


As for shorts, G. Turner's(Go Fish) short "Hummer" is getting some press, but I don't know if that has a lesbian theme or not.

[catwoman]

Note: The 10 Is To View Shorts Only And Some Trailers. Not Full-length Movies For Sundance. Read The Info On The Page For Sundance And Park> Thanks--

[nursefan]

Another question for Catwoman: have you seen/ heard of a show called "The L Word"? Apparently (according to the tabloids) there lots of girl/girl action. I thought you may know about it.

[catwoman]

Yes, I've seen the L-Word. It is a soap opera type show on Showtime cable with a focus on lesbian and bi women. (Has been called "soft-porn" by some folks and reviewers.) There has been alot of publicity surrounding the show for quite sometime (years) esp. in lesbian mags, websites and chat rooms.The mainstream press finally took notice in the last week or so. The premiere was last Sunday and it was pretty good as far as setting up the characters, relationships, and setting. It will be interesting to see how the show and characters develop.

The women on the show are all Hollywood beautiful as is the setting. Laurel Holloman--you may remember her as the blond teenager from "The Incred. True Adventures of Two Girls in Love"--has even shed her tomboy looks for the lipstick lesbian look. She looks quite lovely as do all the women. For more info on the show including clips, interviews, stills, etc. two good places are http://www.lwordonline.com and http://afterellen.com . Afterellen has links to additional sites that also contain clips, etc.

[sweatyfox]

HI Catwoman and fellow g/g fans

The 'L' Word does indeed look interesting, I hope it will end up on terrestrial/broadcast TV here, if not one of the cheaper satellite channels. I found AfterEllen.com from tvandfilmgrrl and it looks like it has good info and background on things. I'll have to check out the other suggestions too.

Catwoman is the human equivalent of Google for things Sapphic related on the net. In fact she's probably better cos she comes up with more relevant results for your search!

Catwoman, I am not really into California Valley porn anymore, having seen the light with sites like this but I do think there were occasionally some lovely natural young actresses that came along. I always loved Stephanie Swift for her pretty face, slightly oriental look, dark hair and natural body. Do you know her or have any favourite female porn stars yourself, on the occasions like myself where you may have stumbled across the X-Rated g/g stuff. I much prefer amateur of course but very very occasionally you'd just get an actress really enthusiastic for women and a non-idiotic director or cameraman who didn't fall into the same traps as usual.

SF

PS Tipping The Velvet coming soon on LLV, BBC UK version.

[catwoman]

No, I really don't like much of the girls in Hollywood porn for the reasons that I've mentioned before...too much big hair, disasterous make-up, tragically fake breats, big shoes, etc. The interaction between the girls is too often just a series of positions that I think the director thinks men will enjoy. Not what women together actually do. Periodically, a film will be recommended by someone with similar tastes and I'll take a gander and I will be pleasantly surprized. Two girls that I do find attractive from the Hollywood group are Felecia and Holly Hollywood. (Holly actually looks best and happiest in the amateur films she has done for Girl Friends Films.)

I don't care for the Japanese porn. That's mainly because I like girls who are a little bigger. (Holly being the exception.) I do like the Japanese porn better then Viv Thomas who I think is highly overrated. (I know many people disagree with me on that score.) I saw his "Pink Velvet" at a friend's house and we all were pretty bored. The horrid music, shaved girls, lack of passion...I think that he used 3/4 of the budget on crotch make-up. The one positive thing that I will say about Viv Thomas films is that I think Katie is probably one of the prettiest girls that I have ever seen.

My Tipping the Velvet dvd arrived on Friday. We had a nice time on Sunday snuggling and watching the show. It was 50 below with the windchill, so it was a much better way to spend the day then outside snowshoeing.

[sweatyfox]

Hi Catwoman

I agree with you on the porn front, on LLV its now straight to browsing the Amateur section. I just meant that occasionally you got a really enthusiastic or cute actress (lke Felecia as you mention) and you thought "how good this could be in the hands of a good director and company", like AW.com for example, where the girls would be left to do their thing and not break out toys after a few minutes of it.

Good to hear you got the Tipping The Velvet DVD, the way its meant to be seen. The BBC did a good job with this one and well done to "The Office" at the Golden Globes, for beating off the tired Yank comedies that get nominated year after year. I loved Jennifer Aniston's face when she was presenting the award, like "who is this?".

As for Viv Thomas, think I have seen that one, is it about some girls who go and stay with a girl and her mother and the mother is seducing them whilst the girls are also after each other. I seem to remember some hilarious lines delivered in thick accents with little emotion. However I thought in a couple of scenes it was quite hot and I did like the lack of toys and attention to build up and seduction. Was Katie one of the brunettes? I had to laugh at your comment about the budget, yes I am afraid that this 'bald as a billiard ball' look seems to be catching on amongst the Eastern European girls now. Shame cos they look too polished, smooth and glossy. Give me 2 Abbywinters girls getting friendly any day and I'll be much more interested.

SF

[catwoman]

Yes, SF, you are thinking of the right movie. You are so right about the dialog and still acting. It would have been better if they used subtitles or just had the girls speak their native tongue. (Did you know the "mother" was 28?) Katie was the brunette who dresses as a "boy"--as if that was possible for her--in the dress up scene. The scene that I thought was the most seductive in Pink Velvet was Joe's fantasy on the train where she imagines making out with the girl reading the book. I too bemoan the current trend of baldness, but at least the girls didn't have Hollywood long fingernails...OUCH! :) At least the baldness trend hasn't taken hold in "real" life.

I know what you mean about the girls working with less direction in the amateur videos. Holly Hollywood does appear in at least one GirlFriendsFilms sans toys. Very hot. Depending on the girls involved, what the toys are and how they are used, I do enjoy them. However, I like a build up to the toys, and not to start using them after 2 minutes.

I didn't watch the Golden Globes, but I do watch The Office. I can just imagine the shock of alot of folks about their win.

Have you seen the movie Gasoline? It never appeared in the theatre here, but it is now out in video/dvd. It looks very good. If you've seen it, let me know what you think of it.

Well, I've seen too episodes of the "L Word". 2nd episode was much better than the first. Alot of lesbians are complaining about the series, but I think we'll have to give it time to see where it will go and remember that it is just a t.v. show. It is certainly not any more explicit then "Tipping the Velvet". Episodes are already online at various torrents, so you should be able to view the show.

[nursefan]

I must take issue with Sweatyfox on baldness. I've been as "bald as a billiard ball" for years and I look dead sexy! :)

[catwoman]

Nursefan: I am sure that you look quite distinquished with your bald noggin. I would rather date a women with a bald head then a bare...:)

--------------------
Did anyone see that Keisha Castle-Huges received a best actress nomination for her role in "Whale Ride"r? I know she'll be a long shot, but it would be nice if she won. I just love the movie and thought that Keisha--and all the actors in the film-- were excellent.

Charlize Theron was also nominated for "Monster" which is another good movie. Theron really earned her Golden Globe in the role. She is just terrific and if you haven't seen the movie already, go.

At Sundance, the full length film, D.E.B.S. received good reviews. There was also news of a Go Fish 2 in the future.

[sweatyfox]

You know what I mean Nursefan, I am talking about THAT hair on girls. C'mon you know I wouldn't insult a fellow g/g lover. So don't take it personally, alright baldy slaphead?

SF

PS Viva la bush (mais notty the George type)

[sweatyfox]

Oh and Catwoman, too right, Whale Rider was a lovely story. I am also glad to see Samantha Morton nominated and the guy who directed City of God. I just watched Amores Perros at the cinema, sheesh that's some film. Monster not out here yet, is Christina Ricci any good in it?

Good to see DEBS on a roll too! Lets just hope for more funny and sexy films like that in the future.

SF

[Vid Dude]

Did anyone see that Keisha Castle-Huges received a best actress nomination for her role in "Whale Ride"r? I know she'll be a long shot, but it would be nice if she won.
That's what they said about Anna Paquin in The Piano.

[sweatyfox]

Now we know Abby likes Alysson Hannigan from Buffy but would you be bowled over Vidman by the chance to shoot some video of Anna Paquin for the site. Cos I think she's very naturally 'girl next door' pretty like many of the girls on this site. Well she's sexy in my opinion. Hold that thought.....Anna Paquin.....revealed.....mmmmmmm that smile, those eyes...(cough) ahem sorry.

Good luck to Keisha and other foreign (ie non American) nominees at the Awards. (Not that I am anti-American, just want to see some variety in the winners, not one film takes all the plaudits). Hope the LOTR does get its dues though.

SF

[catwoman]

Nice but small site with info and clips of tv/movies/etc., Including L-Word and other new shows. http://girlbitz.com/main.php

[sweatyfox]

Thank you Catwoman for coming up with more! Just as I was getting a little bit down at the fact that TVANDFILMGRRLlooks as though its gone for good, a site to compensate just a little bit.

Thanks again, your greatness has been noted. Any gossip on recent lesbian themed videos or films you have seen recently alone or together with others?

SF

[catwoman]

Been enjoying the L-Word. Here is a new L-Word fan site where you can view past shows, join a forum, see fan fiction, etc. http://www.l-word.com/videos/ A little easier than trying to download from a bittorrent.

Saw the recently released Power Up video at a friends. It has 3 shorts and a bonus produced by Power Up. One of the shorts was D.E.B.S., and it was nice to see that in DVD quality. The bonus was very fun--and sometime hot-- with clips of famous movie scenes (From Here to Eternity, The Graduate, etc.) with same gender romance/characters.

Got a surprize this week. A free g/g video from GirlFriendsFilms for an order mix up a while back. It was their new release Women Seeking Women # 7. First set was good if you like toys, second you had the typical WSW theme of a new girl acting dead; third good with no toys (older/younger). So/So DVD, but I usually find that I like one of the sets on their DVDs.

[sweatyfox]

So Catwoman, we will be getting the L Word here after they signed a deal.

And to put the contrast in cultures into perspective, three of our broadcast networks put a bid in for it, even though it will be on 'basic' cable/satellite here in the UK. Can you imagine one of the big three or four US networks showing it with full nudity, and lesbianism. Shock/horror, each episode would have been a couple of minutes long.

Still good news I think but let me know what you're thinking about the series so far Catwoman and anyone else who has seen it on Showtime. Cos so far it seems to have had mixed reviews.

SF

[sweatyfox]

Oh and also by the way I don't know if any other Londoner has seen the ads for the Lesbian and Gay London Film Festival. One has a pic of a bulldog and the other a pic of a cat on it. Now er.......

SF

[catwoman]

Hi SF:

Yeah, I saw on another site that The L-Word was coming your way. It has gotten mixed results to say the least Some lesbians think it is the anti-christ because they show basically attractive upscale lesbians.(My partner and I can't even aggree on who is the sexiest, not atrttactive etc. so I don't know there can be an outside consensus.) Others feel it was written to appeal to straight men too much.(That one I just don't get.) Then I read that some men don't like it because they do not show enough sex. (There is plenty within a storyline, but pretty tame stuff...so I'm not surprized that it won't be on cable in the U.K.) So...goes to show, you can't please everyone...

I view it as a weekly soap opera with lesbian characters and if you take that approach, I think you will enjoy it. On the downside, each episode is directed and written by a different person(s)--and it shows. So far, they are developing the characters and they are doing well with that. Perfect show? No. But a step in the right direction in having lesbian characters portrayed in a series as other than a plot device or ratings ploy for sweeps month. I am hopeful that it will show a market and an expansion of lesbian "drama" like the proposed UPN detective show.

[sweatyfox]

Hey thanks Catwoman

So it has different directors but I presume the writers and producers are the same? I can handle different directors (it is quite common on many shows and perhaps a bit refreshing!) but I wouldn't like no continuity or characters doing something they just wouldn't. Well as you say its good to see a proper series instead of a programme using lesbianism just to pull in the 'punters'. I hope the L Word doesn't go for this during sweeps season (as you call it over there!).

Had any more video nights etc recently. How does the fact the next two Jill and Tamsin vids are going up soon, grab you?

SF

PS Write back soon Catwoman, you've been too quiet, unless you've been indulging in some quality time or naughty stuff, in which case I excuse you and understand totally!

[catwoman]

Hey thanks Catwoman

So it has different directors but I presume the writers and producers are the same?

Producers are the same but the writers are different. They are still developing the characters, but the story line has been very heavy the last few episodes. Next week is at the Dinah Shore Weekend, so I'm hoping that episode will be fun.

Alas, no recent XX (or educational tv as my partner would say) movie get togethers. The last lesbian movie group was about a month ago with some friends and their daughter--who is 15 and also gay. (Hence the need for a semi clean dvd.) Friends brought over Gasoline which I have been wanting to see. Pretty good. Things have been hectic here with family illness, elder care and my busy season at work so I haven't had time to do much surfing on the AW site or anyother for that matter. I'm hoping that things slow down a bit in mid-April.

Nice to know you are thinking of me.

[chiefbrody]

The subject hasn't hit a definitive moment yet in mainstream cinema,we need a broke back for females ;)