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    I agree, merging would be useful to reduce the tag clutter.

    How about a weighting system for the member taggers themselves? For example: a long term tagger (1 year or more) AND who does tags meaningful to the AW community (criteria would be a substantial percentage of thumbs ups). Up votes, or down votes, by these "heavyweight taggers" carry more clout!? So it work like this, Heavyweight Tagger Redblaka sees a tag that is bad/false/nonsense. He votes it down. That counts as 10 (or 100) down votes.
    Good idea or bad idea?

    We should keep posting these ideas for improvements to the tag system. I am sure AW will be able to address the tags at some point.
    I betcha the headaches with the site admin or back-end is their highest priority.

    Comment


      Even though i personally never use the tag function, i can feel the frustration of the members when i see some of the nonsense tags.

      Is it not possible to allow only one or two sub. entries from say, 25 max.( by default,main categories) for each shoot.

      1) Hair...brunette or red or blond...etc.
      2) Eyes...blue or brown...etc.
      3) Pussy...shaved or trimmed...etc.
      4) breast...large nipples or large areola..
      5) bum...small/tight,curvy...etc
      6) Height...tall
      7) Weight...
      .
      .
      23) Other features or accessories...glasses,tattoos.
      24) Nationality
      25) Rate as Favorite...10 or 7 or 5

      I would think there is more than enough info.to isolate the right girl.

      p.s. keep in mind, i've never used the tag system and may not be on the same wave length as one who is.

      RYL tj
      Last edited by tjsunray; 5 June 2011, 10:23 PM.

      Comment


        It's been said before and no doubt will be again many times but the whole tag system is hopelessly flawed, yet the AW management seem unable or unwilling to do anything about it. Not only do you get all the anomalies listed on this page of the discussion but you cannot use it to keep say a list of the shoots you want to take a look at unless you use the favourites function but then how do you keep a track of your favourites as the 2 are not the same?

        It's overdue that the AW team actually take some notice of the negative feedback on the system and either revise the functionality and controls or reinstate the much more flexible and less open to non AW like behaviour lists

        Comment


          Originally posted by bookmanz View Post
          I agree, merging would be useful to reduce the tag clutter.

          How about a weighting system for the member taggers themselves? For example: a long term tagger (1 year or more) AND who does tags meaningful to the AW community (criteria would be a substantial percentage of thumbs ups). Up votes, or down votes, by these "heavyweight taggers" carry more clout!? So it work like this, Heavyweight Tagger Redblaka sees a tag that is bad/false/nonsense. He votes it down. That counts as 10 (or 100) down votes.
          Good idea or bad idea?
          Originally posted by garionhall View Post
          We also have plans for making tagging better:

          (2) When "trusted members" vote a tag up (or down), their vote counts for more (say, 10 - the equivilent of 10 "normal" users performing that same action). AW staff would be "trusted", as would people who AW knows are responsible taggers. (This could be further advanced upon, by having degrees of trust. For example, If lots of people vote up tags you create, you should be more trusted than a user whose evey tag is voted down. Good votes (that other people agree with) should count for more.)

          Due to the CMS2 admin issues, we will not be able to add this feature for some time.
          Looks like they already like your idea about trusted taggers. I'll vote it up

          Pinky

          Comment


            I don't think you can merge tags that have been made by different people - randomly, 'amazing nipples' and 'best assholes' were on display just now, and the trouble is that one member's best body-parts won't be the same as another's. I've made various tags, mostly initially transferred from my lists, and have tried to delete images that other people have added to them, when they don't coincide with my own idea of what that list/tag is about.
            Overall, I don't feel the tag system is working, but I trust that you will let us continue to work on our own tags without combining them with anyone else's!

            Comment


              There are numerous problems with tags. We're aware of them all. We know how much they piss off members. The problems are EXTREMELY annoying. We have a plan to fix them.

              However, right now, that plan is less important than fixing other things (mainly, an Admin system, that removes all the media adding and release issues we have so often).

              When considering tags, keep in mind these facts:
              • Any tag changes take up to 15 mins to be applied for all users, due to synchronisation matters.
              • Adding a tag, and voting a tag does the same thing: adds +1 vote to that tag.
              • Voting a tag down is -1
              • Any one person can only vote once on on tag.
              • You can change your vote at any time.
              • Some tags that people make are considered "bad" and are never displayed (eg, "cunt", "bitch", "slut". If you have other suggestions for banned words, LMK).
              • Tags are shown in number-of-votes order. Top left has the most votes. I think the sub-sort is alpha.


              Also, please consider how tags are intended to work:
              • All community members must participate. If you "leach" - that is, use tags, but don't add or remove tags - the experience will be worse for everyone. You don't have a right to complain or comment, and will be ignored.
              • The system assumes MOST people want to do good things, and - when working completely - will reward people for doing that


              Here's some of our plans to fix the problems:

              Add a threshold option, so you only, ever see tags that have at least n votes.
              Status:Implemented as a user option several months ago on the Prefs page.
              Bad tags almost always have less votes. Set your threshold to 2, and you'll never see tags or results with 2 or less votes.

              Show tags that are made on internal AW systems, to members.
              Status: We have done a bunch of work on changing them over, but there is more to do.
              ATM, tags AW staff make are hidden from member view, due to some technical reasons (they do respond to searches, tho). They are high quality. These include the "shot by..." tags. These will be added with 10 votes to begin with.

              Trusted users confer more votes when tagging
              Status: Some work done, more remaining.
              When a trusted person votes, their votes count for more (be it up, or down). Some users might be 100 (eg, me as Creative Director), most will be 1 (as they are now). Staff might be 20. Active members like those commenting on this thread recently might be 10. Users choose how many votes to apply, from an upper limit we set. This would allow you guys to "smash" down dumb things to be -9 (say), so 10 other people would be required to vote that thing up - very unlikely to happen.

              Identify rogue taggers
              Status: Waiting for work to begin.
              Identify people making dumb tags and "penalise" them (eg, only ever show their tags to themselves).

              User education
              Status: Some work done. Waiting for work to continue.
              Most people are good, and want to make life better for themselves. If coincidentally this makes life better for others, all the better. Our taging videos ("vote good tags up. Vote bad tags down. Add meaningful tags") have helped, but should be more prominent and more compelling. We have hundreds of them, but have only ever shown 10, because changing them is a manual process, and they should randomise on page loads (when admin is released, this will happen). New users should go thru some brief training that is interactive and engaging (but also skippable).

              Projects to encourage meanginful user tagging
              Status: Waiting for work to begin
              For example, the only way to get one-on-one web cam time with (say) Kylie H is to add lots of meaningful tags. Costs you $0 (we pay Kaylie H!). The more more-meaningful tags you add, the less your rebills are (people who are time poor will pay more to have good tag results when searching).

              Merging tags by admin
              Status: Waiting for work to begin.
              As suggested above, "merge" tags. Or really, make "red head" = "redhead" - searching for either returns the same results. Allow trusted members to propose new "merges", other trusted members vote to agree, and the new merge are automatically enacted.

              Comment


                Great to know that tags will be improved.

                Originally posted by garionhall View Post
                Add a threshold option, so you only, ever see tags that have at least n votes.
                Status:Implemented as a user option several months ago on the Prefs page.
                Bad tags almost always have less votes. Set your threshold to 2, and you'll never see tags or results with 2 or less votes.
                For now, the threshold seems to only have an impact on search results. On a shoot page, we see every tags applied to this shoot (even the ones bellow 1 vote ?).

                Comment


                  Great detailed reply, any thoughts on restricting creation of entirely NEW tags ? That's the source of a lot of badly/mis-spelled and/or useless (e.g. 'downloaded') tags.

                  The tags-vote-threshold indeed only applies to searches currently. Can you add a threshold-specify to the search page so it can be specified per search? E.g. if you only want 'site supported' anal-tags, search on 'anal' with threshold 11. Something like that. Obviously that will only work once such site-supported/applied tags are ranked up.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Frans View Post
                    useless (e.g. 'downloaded') tags
                    "downloaded" is indeed useless since tags are shared by all users -- strong indicator that users want a means of tracking what they've downloaded/watched though.

                    Comment


                      Thanks Mr. Hall...

                      Looks like you are aware of our frustrations and have plans to resolve most of them. Is there stats on how many tags are voted up and down currently?? What is the most voted up and most voted down tag currently?? I like the hint of cam time also... especially using Kylie H as an example.

                      Thanks... will show a little patience well until I forget and join in on next persons frustration in the near future.

                      Comment


                        Thanks for the update Garion, sounds pretty good to me!

                        In the latest special message about tags, Zoey illustrates by pointing out her glasses and full bush!

                        Comment


                          I think that if you look at the tags as a replacement for the old lists, they're not too bad. The lists weren't perfect either. Many of the tags are terrible, but I just disregard them and only click on the ones that look interesting. The only problem really for me is that if you click on a tag and get a page of images, you can't open the first image and then click on the "Next" arrow to get to the next image in the list; what happens is that you get the next image in the shoot that the image was originally from. That's annoying but not really a big deal.

                          If you look at tags as a search engine, which is what they're supposed to be as well, then they're hopeless. Partly because the system of model tags, shoot tags and image tags is so complicated to use (I still can't work it out properly); partly because when you do get results they're often completely inaccurate; partly because you often don't get any results at all; and partly because not all of the models and shoots from the early days are properly tagged, so they don't show up.

                          But then again, one solution is to just keep on browsing. The archive is full of gems, even if they're not ones you're looking for.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by JacksonP49 View Post
                            The only problem really for me is that if you click on a tag and get a page of images, you can't open the first image and then click on the "Next" arrow to get to the next image in the list; what happens is that you get the next image in the shoot that the image was originally from.
                            Can you open each image on the tag list in a new tab (eg by middle-clicking them)?

                            I prefer doing this in general from search result pages anyway, so that lower entries on the list load while I'm viewing the higher entries.

                            Comment


                              Don't know, I'm sorry.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by violetafan View Post
                                Can you open each image on the tag list in a new tab (eg by middle-clicking them)?

                                I prefer doing this in general from search result pages anyway, so that lower entries on the list load while I'm viewing the higher entries.
                                Yes that works fine, that way one can look pictures in a list one by one.

                                Comment


                                  Question: Why are there so many "generic or useless tags such as "nudity". "live sound". etc. ?

                                  Comment


                                    Originally posted by Maxim10 View Post
                                    Question: Why are there so many "generic or useless tags such as "nudity". "live sound". etc. ?
                                    Live sound is probably a hang-over from the old videos where some just had music playing in the background while some had "live sound". Maybe "nudity" comes from the image tags, as in some individual pictures within a set are clothed and some there is "nudity" but would be useless if tagged against a model of set.

                                    But don't vote them down if they are actually correct.

                                    Pinky
                                    Last edited by mrpinkeyes; 11 June 2011, 02:20 AM. Reason: saying vote it down was WRONG as pointed out by Mr Hall, amended my post to reflect this

                                    Comment


                                      well, don't vote down tags if they are correct! Generic classifications are valuable - perhaps not to you right now, but definitely to others in the future.

                                      Many tags are generic. Tags that are incorrect (eg, tagged with "live sound", and it's actually not) should be voted down. Generic tags should be left as they are - or voted up if correct!

                                      Pinky is right - many of our videos did NOT have live sound. Also, in the old days, vids were released in several parts, and sometimes the first part had no nudity.

                                      Comment


                                        Could you limit the length of a tag to prevent tags like "tung makeing pussy hot cumming and flowing cum" or "showing fringers going deep in pussy hot cumming hole" ?

                                        Comment


                                          I don't know about anybody else, but with the new design I cannot vote tags down or up, as I try to move the cursor over the thumbs it changes line, unles you're at the bottom line. And btw I don't like the new design I think it takes too much space for nothing, taking one line for each tags.

                                          Comment


                                            Originally posted by casgrain View Post
                                            I don't know about anybody else, but with the new design I cannot vote tags down or up, as I try to move the cursor over the thumbs it changes line, unles you're at the bottom line. And btw I don't like the new design I think it takes too much space for nothing, taking one line for each tags.
                                            The new/current design doesn't take one line for each tag, must be a problem with your browser or something. What browser do you use? I just tested IE9 and Firefox5 and both show it fine with up/down thumbs when I hoober over a tag. Could you post a screenshot of how a shootpage looks for you?

                                            Comment


                                              Originally posted by Frans View Post
                                              The new/current design doesn't take one line for each tag, must be a problem with your browser or something. What browser do you use? I just tested IE9 and Firefox5 and both show it fine with up/down thumbs when I hoober over a tag. Could you post a screenshot of how a shootpage looks for you?
                                              I use IE8 and this is what it looks like.
                                              Attached Files

                                              Comment


                                                Please check if you are displaying that page using IE7 compatibility. Normal IE8 works fine for me, but IE7-compat mode does indeed result in that weird displaying of tags.

                                                Comment


                                                  Originally posted by Frans View Post
                                                  Please check if you are displaying that page using IE7 compatibility. Normal IE8 works fine for me, but IE7-compat mode does indeed result in that weird displaying of tags.
                                                  Thanks Frans, actually it did without my knowing of it. Now it's fine.

                                                  Comment


                                                    Ok, I admit that I have one or another fetish, lol...

                                                    On old AW I had a few favorite tags ("The view you love to smell" was one, seriously... oh I loved this one... ever heard of: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olfactophilia ? I'm a serious case of that... my favorites are ass, pussy and armpits, in this order).

                                                    But here, the tag system is totally pointless, really. :-(

                                                    Let me give you an example:

                                                    Sometimes I'm really looking for "ok T3 girls, heh... and PLEASE some ass licking", but I mean, come on... "anal tongue" means everything BUT "anal tongue", which makes me sad. :-(

                                                    Comment


                                                      I was interested in a comment by Frans on another thread about tags so went looking further. As a result here are two ideas I'd like to offer for comment:

                                                      Allowing members to create their own tags has resulted in a tag list containing literally thousands of items. Many tags are duplicated over and over again; example: the tag list contains 36 items with reference to "anal". Many other tags are irrelevant, such as "hot" (ALL Abby models are hot!) or simply display personal opinion, such as "great boobs". I wonder if perhaps it’s time for a re-think on the tag system?

                                                      Members supposedly use tags to find what interests them reasonably quickly so a list as unwieldy as this can only make it more difficult. Could I suggest that the entire tag list be gone through, the most popular headings selected and from these a new list created that members can pick from to tag their favourite shoots.

                                                      Perhaps this revised tag list can be used in this way:
                                                      Replace the tags on side bar of the page with the single item "TAGS" which produces a pop-up list from which to choose. As each tag is selected it then becomes part of the search, similar to the current system that uses the "extra tags" option.

                                                      OK, admittedly this no longer allows members to create their own personal tags on display for everyone but is does offer all members a comprehensive and far more useful list which provides a standard, simplified method for searching. If personal tags are needed can I suggest a function whereby these can be added by each member within their “My Accounts” facility. This would still give members the ability to personalise while reducing the baffling display of tags on each shoot.

                                                      As an example to show what a revised tag list would show, here are the tags on the latest GG shoot with Elisa and Hania - 21 in total. Wouldn't those shown in bold be enough to describe the video just as efficiently, without all the extra clutter? Are all those extra tags really necessary or do they just make searching more difficult?

                                                      girl-girl hardcore
                                                      tribbing
                                                      orgasms
                                                      natural bush
                                                      full bush
                                                      hairy
                                                      great boobs
                                                      pert boobs
                                                      hot
                                                      great body
                                                      slim
                                                      pale skin
                                                      glasses

                                                      polish
                                                      british
                                                      shared knickers
                                                      xl images
                                                      stlls by masie
                                                      video by masie
                                                      video by misha


                                                      Now for my second idea:
                                                      Could the profile on each model's home page show their nationality? Many members are obviously interested to know this and currently use tags to indicate this information. This can be misleading as in at least one instance the model has been tagged incorrectly. If the model does not wish for this information to be available then perhaps a note on her profile could read "not available".

                                                      I can see AW staff and the IT people rolling their eyes and thinking “Does he know just how much work this means?” Apologies everyone – it's only just an idea that I thought might help improve the site!
                                                      Last edited by boomertoo; 5 January 2015, 05:35 AM.

                                                      Comment


                                                        Boomer, the tags seem to be a lost cause. There are untold millions of completely useless tags that crop up everywhere and lead nowhere.

                                                        There are some dedicated taggers who use sense and logic, eg "Lem". If you keep your eye on the Recent Tags box you will frequently see it full of Lem's Onecut, Lem's Invitations, and a whole host of others, and if you click on one of those tags you will be taken to page after page of thumbnail images -- and you will understand exactly why Lem has tagged them.

                                                        Which brings me to what is for me the most infuriating problem with the tag system. If you click on one of those images, you expect to see the full-size version of the thumbnail. But you don't. You get taken to a shoot, and if you want to see the image that was tagged, you have to open the stills set and scroll through until you find it. In other words, an image was tagged, but somehow the system has translated it into a tag for the whole shoot. This is the case for all image tags, eg The Marvelous Letter M, or Looking Back, where again there are pages of thumbnails of similar images, but each thumbnail takes you to a whole shoot.

                                                        If I could choose one thing to have fixed, that would be it. But no work appears to have been done on the tag system for several years.

                                                        Comment


                                                          Jackson, thanks for the input.
                                                          I gather that the tag system replaced lists around 2010, which means that it's taken only about 4 years to introduce these thousands of tags. At this rate I can't see it being too much longer before the system chokes. The tag lists already take a long time to load and when the pages start to come on screen the sheer number of tags just leaves you thinking: "Why bother?"

                                                          While there were 21 tags for the Hania-Elisa shoot there were also 23 for the latest Thais solo shoot. For me that is already way too much information, but how long before that number climbs to 50 or more?

                                                          I would imagine that a standard tag list of no more than 100 or so would cover everyone's basic needs and if personal tags can be added to members' Account facility I think it would make for a very useable system. Regarding the stills, I guess only the IT people would know if single images could be tagged, but if so it would certainly be a handy option to offer members.
                                                          Last edited by boomertoo; 6 January 2015, 06:20 AM.

                                                          Comment


                                                            boomertoo, you know you can set a 'Tag Threshold' in your Preferences (right-top) ? I'm not sure why you think the tags themselves take long to load, never noticed such myself? Either way, the threshold thing lets you filter (which solves the visual issue at least).

                                                            Jackson, you can indeed tag images, as well as shoots, models and videos. It depends on what was tagged what you get to on clicking it. But if you look it this small tag: http://www.abbywinters.com/amateurs/...+sided+breasts and click on any you will be taken directly to the photo tagged.

                                                            Comment


                                                              Hi Frans

                                                              On the Hania-Elisa shoot I did reset tags from (3) to (5) and still got 21 tags. Reset to (20) and got only 2, one of which was "girl girl hardcore" which seems to be fairly obvious without tagging!

                                                              I still believe that a much shorter standard list of commonly used tags would be better for members who want to do a search. Providing personal tags can be added to members' account pages I think this could be a very useable system.

                                                              PS That full tag list really is a pain!

                                                              Comment

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