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    Let's improve AW search results

    You've probably noticed that results from searches on AW are poor. We're finally able to allocate some time to fixing this. It will be a phased approach:

    Phase 1: Identify what people are actually searching for, how satisfied they are with results (released Apr 28, 2015)
    Phase 2: Research our current search methodology (was created 7 years ago, those staff no longer work here); and best practises in search now
    Phase 3: Implement fixes
    Phase 4: fine-tune based on feedback

    I expect this will take at least several months, perhaps with some incremental changes. In a few weeks, we'll launch Phase 1. When searching, your search terms will be recorded (without your username or any other personal data), and you'll be asked to assess the quality of your search result. Staff will get a daily digest of search results, to get a better idea of what folks are actually searching for. We're asking that you assess your results each time you search.

    Here's the place to discuss these works, and the current system.

    If you're posting to complain or praise the search system, it'd be very helpful to:
    1. Specify what you are searching for, with the precise term in quotes (eg, I search for "blonde mooseknuckle"),
    2. What you wanted to see ("I wanted a bunch of blonde models wearing tight pants (stockings, jeans, yoga pants, etc), showing the outline of their labia clearly"), and
    3. What you actually got ("I got one result, of a brunette in a skirt and no panties").

    A reminder that the "Tage Threshold" setting on the Prefs page has a huge effect on the search results you see.
    Last edited by garionhall; 28 April 2015, 01:02 PM. Reason: fix formatting; mention Phase 1 deets; add release date

    #2
    Hi Garion

    Not sure if this will help but I've given it a go. My brain already hurts from thinking about this so I don't envy you the task of sorting it out!

    It appears to me that the basic problem lies with the fact that tags are allocated by members. The result of this is that there are literally thousands of tags, many of which are specific only to whichever member allocated them and to a specific shoot so would have little or no use to anyone else. The tag list has become incredibly huge and confusing, containing many variations of the same item which range from general to pinpoint specifics, e.g.: Under "Hairy" there are 63 entries alone.

    The current system also relies on members tagging correctly, which is not always the case. As an instance of this I can search "Models" for "Australian" (no surprise there!) and receive a list of models some of which are clearly not. It is also possible that a tag has been allocated by association rather than direct reference. An example is that of Rosa M (Swedish) who appears on that same list seemingly because she shot a scene with Brooklyn, who is tagged Australian. Another, better example is by browsing "Models" and selecting "blonde" from the tag list. A lot of non-blondes appear! To me this indicates that the current system is not functioning efficiently.

    "I wanted a bunch of blonde models wearing tight pants (stockings, jeans, yoga pants, etc), showing the outline of their labia clearly".
    I understand that it is important to provide members with as good a service as possible but before making big changes perhaps the first question that should be asked is: How many members actually require such detailed search requirements when they first enter the site and is it absolutely necessary to provide that facility?

    A basic set of tags should be enough to start members off and allow them to begin searching for those shoots that interest them without necessarily having to start from scratch. Once members find what they are looking for their "My Account" page provides an excellent way for them to keep note of their favourites. Surely, exploring a site is one of the enjoyable aspects for any member, new or existing, and in searching for specific interests it's likely they will find other shoots to enjoy and thus expand their involvement with the site. (On a personal note I love exploring and finding a shoot that interests me but I realise some would rather not expend the time and effort.)

    I would recommend that staff produce a list of basic tags that would be the most useful/popular. The initial phase could be to select those tags marked as important on the tag list by their font size. This list could perhaps then be revised by uploading it onto the site and asking members to comment. As a simplified alternative ask members for only which categories are important to them, i.e.: hair colour, complexion, etc. From this a final list be prepared and staff or, if a possibility perhaps volunteer members, would then begin the onerous task of re-tagging shoots properly.

    The "My Account" Page already has an excellent facility where members can identify which shoots interest them. Expanding this facility to allow them to enter written headers (not tags) to their favourites page(s) would help them keep track of these. Using an efficient basic tag system would tend to direct those with specific interests into better use of this facility and so satisfy their requirements without cluttering up the site for others. I believe it would also negate the need for a Tag Threshold.

    I would also suggest that the tag list replace all tags and fetishes on the left side of the page. This list should allow multiple choices to be selected as is the current system. If the basic tag list is overly long perhaps it is possible to produce sub-sections for certain categories, thus:
    Selecting "Hair" would produce a sub-section that includes such categories as: blonde, brunette, redhead, short, long, etc.
    Selecting "Complexion" would produce pale, dark, tanned, etc.
    Selecting "Nationality" would produce an interesting list!

    I wondered if certain information could be provided on each models profile, such as "Nationality" or perhaps "Current Age"?. Could this information be picked up by the search system without resorting to using tags?

    These changes would obviously need a great deal of work. It would need members Accounts Pages to be modified, would need all shoots to be re-tagged using the basic list and it would require a difficult change-over from the current system. However, in the end I think this would produce a fair search system that would be efficient for all members yet still allow specific information to be entered for those who need it.
    Last edited by boomertoo; 24 April 2015, 06:48 AM.

    Comment


      #3
      If you set 'tag threshold' in My Account to (3 votes or more) that clears out a lot of confusing or irrelevant matches. It also cleans up the list of tags on the left in Browse/Search. Is that setting the default for members, if not should it be?

      There are a few members who can upvote or downvote (ir)relevant tags, possibly more are needed?

      I do think the 'cascaded' matches are confusing, example;

      Threshold=5 votes
      Search : http://www.abbywinters.com/amateurs/...rch=Australian
      Among results: http://www.abbywinters.com/nude_girl/long_legs/nichole

      which is incorrect model Nichole has no tag 'Australian' . However this shoot has http://www.abbywinters.com/girl_girl...hloe_b_nichole so I suspect it was matched that way. For 'model' search that is confusing though, to me anyway

      Or http://www.abbywinters.com/amateurs/...search=redhead
      including http://www.abbywinters.com/nude_girl...reasts/kylie_h .. it may well technically be correct but it's not expected.

      I often search for models by name and more then one match for a specific model isn't uncommon;

      Use powerful filters and search to find real amateur shoots that float your boat - even if you're not a member.

      which includes http://www.abbywinters.com/nude_girl/hippy/jilly among results, now Jilly has done a shoot with Chloe B but that doesn't seem to cause it as this multiple-match issue doesn't occur for say 'Noa'.

      Comment


        #4
        We have now released Phase 1 of the project, recording what customers are searching for. There's a small ratings question at the top of the search results, looks like this:
        Attached Files

        Comment


          #5
          When searching for a model, the best of and the backstages should be at the end of the results because they don't contain only this model.

          Comment


            #6
            redlabka, agree, good point.

            Comment


              #7
              the best of and the backstages should be at the end of the results
              I'll second that idea as the BTS tend to clutter up the results. I gave 3 out of 5 because of this.
              There are still some problems which will likely get sorted out over time. As an example I searched for Angie and the results included a lot of Chloe B shoots.

              If I could mention one point as a side issue: can the header colour on the thumbnails be changed on the fun shoots? At the moment it's pink, same as GG, which is a little confusing.

              Comment


                #8
                I was just searching for the model Adelle. I entered Adelle and the results started with her (I believe) answering some of your questions, then there is girl-girl etc before the model pages are found. I would think if I was looking for a model the first results should be the model page with the listing like this Age: 25 | Height: 173 cm | Aries. It could be different limiters may need to be placed on the search engine cover all types of searches: my search may require a box checked model and would give the search result I wanted.
                Last edited by jsnyder1; 6 May 2015, 04:42 AM.

                Comment


                  #9
                  A regular search by default searches *shoots* , not models. The model page you saw probably was her solo shoot. If you want to search for a specific model, you need to tick 'model' left in the 'type' selector.

                  Click image for larger version

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                  Comment


                    #10
                    thanks, good points, I have added them to the list.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      The search seems terribly UN-intuitive. For example, I searched for Renae D. I should get results for her, right? I would expect a list of her appearances. But I get a mish-mash of irrelevant results with a few of her appearances sprinkled in. Why is a video by Sylvanna included in the results of a search for Renae D? Following the comment above, I ticked "model." Now I have 6 results, only one of which is Renae D. But the Sylvanna video is one of the six.

                      It used to work much better.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        hey jajarthur, yes, this is the most frustrating thing, and the first thing we'll be fixing. We start work on it in a few weeks, and should see some basic changes released soon after.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by jaharthur View Post
                          The search seems terribly UN-intuitive. For example, I searched for Renae D. I should get results for her, right? I would expect a list of her appearances. But I get a mish-mash of irrelevant results with a few of her appearances sprinkled in. Why is a video by Sylvanna included in the results of a search for Renae D?
                          Because somebody added renae d as tag to shoot: http://www.abbywinters.com/nude_girl...ateur/sylvanna , I've downvoted that so it's gonna now

                          I *highly* suspect this was caused by the Search field right-top of page being right above the 'add tag' box on same page. (sort of work-around for that would be to make the 'add tag' box ignore 'ENTER' as a submit button, forcing people to actually click the 'add tag' button)

                          Search results are much better with tag-threshold set to 5, but if everybody does that new tags will never *get* five votes

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Because somebody added renae d as tag to shoot
                            I have to repeat what I've said before and that is the tag system is at least a part of the problem. One single example of wrong tagging is model Brooklyn, tagged incorrectly as German at least twice and then correctly as American on other shoots. While members are allowed to tag openly instead of just privately on their own Accounts Page there will continue to be search problems.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              I think model's name shouldn't be allowed as tags (and removed from existing tags unless multiple people voted for it), that would fix some confusion at least. For example I'm pretty sure that is causing 'Gretchen' to match as a model for query http://www.abbywinters.com/amateurs/...earch=sabina+m but I can't find on what shoot yet (I suspect on of Gretchen's shoot has tag 'sabina m'). This is with threshold=1, with it set to 3 this problem goes away.

                              Comment


                                #16
                                To prevent having too much wrong tags, AW should start by changing the place of the "Add tag" field. Putting it right under the search field may cause a lot of wrong tagging...

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  I feel sorry to admit, but your search engine is totally bad, it is so hard to find thing here.. When i want to find certain type of video or shoot most of the time i find unrelated result or half of the result. Suppose i put in the search engine: naughty, it will return my models (probably just some off that have be tagged...) naughty but none of the one tagged : naughty girl or : naughty girls but in the real they should be all represented. If i enter pee, i should see video and shoot whit pee, peeing, piss, pissing etc... it is all the same fantasy... something need to be done about that.

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    One problem that should be fixable is that where you have a tag attached to a number of images and you click on that tag, you get a series of thumbnails of specific images; but when you click on the thumbnail, you are taken to the whole shoot. Eg Image 185 in Stella's solo shoot is tagged The Marvelous Letter M. If you want to see more images like that one and click on the tag, you are taken to a page of 411 thumbnails of images of models in similar poses, starting with Alma. However if you then click on the thumbnail of Alma because you want to see the image full size, you get taken to the shoot page of Alma's shoot from July 2010, and if you want to see the image you were looking for, you have to go into the stills set and scroll through till you find it.

                                    Also, for me it is impossible to do a simple search of an image tag. Eg, if I type "The Marvelous Letter M" into the search box on the home page, the tag appears before I finish typing it, but when I press search, I get to the "0 results" page. Similarly, if I go to the Browse Images page and type the tag into the search box, I again get zero results. In both cases, when the 0 results page appears, in the sidebar on the left of screen, under the heading "active filters", it shows that the search has been for shoots, even though the tag is an image tag.
                                    Last edited by JacksonP49; 20 May 2015, 03:48 AM.

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      I noticed when looking at Backstage set 413, there is more than one model with the same picture image. Jenni and Dolly share the same picture, as well as Felicity and Everette.

                                      Another super sexy image set with the beautiful models joking and teasing each other behind the cameras, but the Abbywinters.com backstage lens picks up all the deliciously sexy and natural moments. Some of the models that appear in this set is Rosanna, Dolly, Catrinia, Allison, Everette, Meagan K, Jenni, Joannie and Leiko. Some Indoor and some outdoor shoots where the girls love to walk around half nude, so here we get a peak behind the lights and equipment.

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by Skin25 View Post
                                        I noticed when looking at Backstage set 413, there is more than one model with the same picture image. Jenni and Dolly share the same picture, as well as Felicity and Everette.

                                        http://www.abbywinters.com/behind_th.../backstage_413
                                        Yeah, that's a known problem Working on getting that fixed. See also this thread: http://forums.abbywinters.com/vbulle...ad.php?t=18142

                                        Comment


                                          #21
                                          Today we released the first of several changes to AW search: showing second-degree results.

                                          How it used to be: When search for, say, "redhead", results were returned that included models who had done a shoot with a model who was tagged as "redhead". That's just dumb.

                                          How it is now: When searching for "redhead", only entities that are tagged with "redhead" will be returned. It's not perfect, but the other fixes we'll be releasing to Search will improve this.

                                          Comment


                                            #22
                                            Search does not work at all for "tags"

                                            This search is a complete and utter waste of time.
                                            Firstly: it doesn't give any relevant results for the search.
                                            example: I did a search for Lem's Danglers and got maybe two irrelevant photos.
                                            Secondly: The tag search (ie clicking on a tag {once again Lem's Danglers}) was a similar waste of time and gave the same two irrelevant results.
                                            {That is after waiting for L to appear in the million or so tags}
                                            Why did I choose Lem's Danglers? Quality control - because a "Random Tag" listed it one day and clicking it gave pages of results.
                                            In fact the searching and access through tags does not work and as far as I am concerned membership of the site is largely a complete waste of money.
                                            It isutterly disappointing

                                            Comment


                                              #23
                                              lawrie, could you copy/paste the url you used for that search? I can't find the tag you mention.

                                              Comment


                                                #24
                                                Originally posted by Frans View Post
                                                lawrie, could you copy/paste the url you used for that search? I can't find the tag you mention.
                                                It doesn't really matter what tag it is - there is an alphabetical list of a million tags try any of them.
                                                I've just tried "holding hands" which appeared on random tags on the home page - about 100 images
                                                So key it in the search box {which displayed a drop down with this in} just 1 shoot dislays.
                                                So try any tag from the massive list. It's easier if you access one tag through "random tags" on the home page and then try and get the contents by either a search or by clicking on the huge alphabetical list.
                                                You won't find anything worthwhile displayed.

                                                Comment


                                                  #25
                                                  lawrie, if you search from the search box right-top you search (only) for shoots. I suspect the 'holding hands' tag you saw in random tags was this one:

                                                  http://www.abbywinters.com/amateurs/.../holding+hands , which is an images tag.

                                                  If you want to reach that result by entering something in Search box, you need to set type to "Images" after your initial search (images searches are slow 'cos there are lots of images).

                                                  In future if you have problems with a search or it gives bad results please copy/paste the url to the search results here and tell us what you expected wanted as result.

                                                  Comment


                                                    #26
                                                    Lawrie, you are correct, it's terrible. But, we're working on improving it. I cannot see ANY results for "lem's danglers" either. I don;t recall ever seeing that as a tag, but I concede it may have been, but it's not any more. You're probably seeking models with large labia, though? If so, you'll find this page more helpful.

                                                    Large pussy lips – sometimes called “meaty lips” are where the labia minora and / or the labia majora protrude out from the vulva. It’s interesting to watch girls play with their flaps – pull them wide open to see how long they can go, hang weights from them, or tie them in a knot! Beef curtains, meat flaps, butterfly wings; whatever you call ‘em, we’ve shot some truly incredible ample labias over the years. Enjoy a collection of the softest, juiciest, pussy lips we could muster.


                                                    We're working on integrating that into search results better.

                                                    But, if you are completely dissatisfied, contact me by email, we can organise a partial refund. garion.hall@abbywinters.com

                                                    Comment


                                                      #27
                                                      Garion
                                                      Do you think it's worth considering something similar to what I suggested on my above post of 24th April - maybe an AW allocated basic tag set to replace the existing system?

                                                      Comment


                                                        #28
                                                        Boomer, we have considered it, but then discarded it.

                                                        We can do better than that, but we're (clearly) not there yet.

                                                        Comment


                                                          #29
                                                          Garion, is it possible to do a little clean out of the tags? Maybe go through and delete the silly or ultra-specific tags from the list, even reduce some of the multiples such as the 63 "hairy" entries? Also could there be a function on the site, maybe a specific forum thread, where members can quickly report mis-tagging so these can be adjusted?
                                                          I know this is only tinkering at the edges but maybe every little bit might help.
                                                          It's a big site so, as I said on my post: I don't envy you the task of sorting it out!

                                                          Comment


                                                            #30
                                                            Hey Boomer, Yes, it's possible to clean out the tags. But, I am not sure it's necessary.

                                                            Can you explain more about why "i am boomer and I think mary has fantastic calves" is bad to have? (I think this is what you mean?)

                                                            Comment

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