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Liandra's blog: AbbyWinters criticism.

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    Liandra's blog: AbbyWinters criticism.

    Hello everyone.

    First, sorry for my English.

    We all know that Liandra was a model of AbbyWinters in the past. Well, today I've reading an old post of her blog that criticizes AbbyWinters and I'm worried about what she wrote.
    Here is the post:
    http://web.archive.org/web/20071206153648/http://liandradahl.blogspot.com/2007/06/liandra-lets-loose.html

    What do you think about this? This is a question I ask everyone but above all I am very interested in the opinion and experience of the models in this matter.

    Thank you.

    PD: I don't know if this topic has been discussed in this forum. I've been searching but have not found anything. If the topic has been discussed, please put me the link to the discussion.

    #2
    hi there, firstly I'm not a model but personally I wouldn't worry about any of the comments Liandra makes in her (very old) post, its nothing that any other aspiring model who has decided/wanted/been tempted to do nude (or more hardcore) modeling/porn and once done has had second thoughts about what impact it will have on her future (regular modelling,boyfriends,change of career etc), though it didn't stop her doing 9 shoots for A/W plus however many others she has done for other similar sites.

    If she was that worried about these shoots being available for free on the internet then she obviously doesn't understand the internet and the fact that it was originally designed to be free access for all, it was only when someone thought that they could make money out of it that porn (and other) sites started charging people to view previously free material.

    In my opinion the whole post is just Liandra's chance to vent her frustration at someone (who in this case happens to be A/W) maybe her "modelling" career didn't take off like she hoped.

    Hope this helps.

    Comment


      #3
      I doubt that this thread will remain in existence for very long. About another 12 hours max, I'd say.

      Liandra's blog eventually led to an anti-abbywinters campaign by the Herald Sun in Melbourne, which led to Garion being charged with various offences, of which he pleaded guilty to one, and then moved the site to Amsterdam, where it struggled from the outset and is a shadow of what it was.

      Liandra subsequently recanted much of what she said.

      The basic allegation was that girls needing money were being induced to pose for a porn site and being misled into believing that the content would never be able to be viewed by anyone other than subscribers. It's doubtful to what extent any of them actually believed that, but if such things were said, they were lies. The content has always been downloadable, and once it's downloaded it's out of the site's control.

      Many of the models signed consents allowing their images to be used for advertising. And the site never made any pretence of being anything other than porn -- nice, female-friendly porn, but porn nevertheless.

      It's all history now, and I doubt that any of the current (post-move) models are under any illusions about what will hapoen once the images and videos are on line. That's probably part of the reason why all the models (with VERY few exceptions) have done it before and are used to posing nude for porn sites.

      Comment


        #4
        Have checked Liandra's own website (Liandra Dahl.com) and saw Michelle Flynn and Keilyn at her home. Apparently the two wanted to marry, but somehow they failed. At least on Michelle's website, which is a mess, there is no Liandra appearing. On the other hand, old Chloe gets a lot of attention with other girls from ex GOW. Both of them, after leaving AW have no proper website and seem to be quite hopeless. I believe that most of the AW girls in Amsterdam are quite professional and know what they are doing.
        A pity, but casting innocent girls might be quite a big and difficult job. However I preferred Michelle's management to the Masie's.

        Comment


          #5
          It's kind of a minor accusation isn't it? Essentially the complaint is that piracy isn't being discussed with the models. And I think she was wrong in saying that they don't care about piracy because its free advertising. Piracy is illegal theft and not part of the design of the site or the company, even if it is prevalent.

          That 18-24 is too young is another issue altogether. I'll admit that it feels too young to me, 18/19 especially. I wonder how girls have come to this decision so early, but then I try and remember that everyone is different. Kylie and Yara were both quite young 21/20 (I think) or thereabouts when I shot with them, but I am also quite confident they knew exactly what they were doing. They are both such intelligent, confident, strong women that I don't worry about their age at all.

          On paper it can sound bad, but I've honestly never met a girl while shooting for AW and thought 'oh honey, what are you doing here?'

          I'm not necessarily saying that any of the sites mentioned are getting porn perfectly right (ethically or morally speaking), and I don't know Richard at all, but her complaints, when you really look at them are not much. Some of what she says is a complaint about society and porn in general and therefore not really an attack on the sites at all.

          Comment


            #6
            > I doubt that this thread will remain in existence for very long. About another 12 hours max, I'd say.
            You need to revise your estimate.

            > all the models (with VERY few exceptions) have done it before and are used to posing nude for porn sites.
            What's the basis for your assertion? Do you have stats? Just wondering how you would know.

            > Michelle's website, which is a mess
            lightsouthern.com, right? Seems pretty sharp to me.

            > A pity, but casting innocent girls might be quite a big and difficult job.
            It's a nice fantasy to assume that porn models aren't sexually active, or to believe that they're innocents who have made a momentary decision to go from cloistered home schooling to spreading their legs just for you. I guess that's what drives the whole pigtails, candy, short kilt fetish. But it doesn't seem healthy to me, as it's just a little too close to child porn. Isn't it more of a turn on to watch well educated, confident, sexually aware women who know exactly what they're doing? It is for me.
            Last edited by AarontheMoor; 23 March 2016, 06:11 AM.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by AarontheMoor View Post
              > I doubt that this thread will remain in existence for very long. About another 12 hours max, I'd say.
              You need to revise your estimate.

              > all the models (with VERY few exceptions) have done it before and are used to posing nude for porn sites.
              What's the basis for your assertion? Do you have stats? Just wondering how you would know.

              > Michelle's website, which is a mess
              lightsouthern.com, right? Seems pretty sharp to me.

              > A pity, but casting innocent girls might be quite a big and difficult job.
              It's a nice fantasy to assume that porn models aren't sexually active, or to believe that they're innocents who have made a momentary decision to go from cloistered home schooling to spreading their legs just for you. I guess that's what drives the whole pigtails, candy, short kilt fetish. But it doesn't seem healthy to me, as it's just a little too close to child porn. Isn't it more of a turn on to watch well educated, confident, sexually aware women who know exactly what they're doing? It is for me.
              Yes, my guess was wrong. It was based on experience (e.g., seeing the post about Sophie's porn work for other sites deleted the other day only a short time after it appeared), but it was wrong.

              As for the fact that real first timers are almost non-existent now, that's based on a number of things including personal observation, posts by other members, and posts by the models themselves. There's the occasional one, but they're very rare.

              Before AW left Australia quite a few of the models were genuine first timers. The number diminished greatly as soon as the site moved to Amsterdam. Whether there would still be genuine first timers in Australia now is debatable, but there certainly aren't many willing to pose for AW in Europe.

              Comment


                #8
                I just started modeling for AW so I'm not sure how things where when AW was still in Australia, but with my first conversation with AW people (in Amsterdam) I did feel informed about what would happen to the pictures and video's if I decided to work with them. I think I would have actually disliked any more emphasis on things like piracy ('Yes I do know how the internet works, thank you').

                They give clear information about the way they handle things and how the site works. Any more excessive informing is probably only necessary with really vulnerable people. But as Renae says, you don't really come across those 'o poor honey' types at AW. All the AW woman I have met so far are intelligible confident woman who can decided for themselves what kind of work they want to do and how this will effect them.
                I mean, sure there are probably some really uninformed people out there in the world, but as a young first time model I feel like you can't just assume someone doesn’t know what they are doing just because they are young or haven’t done it before.

                Comment


                  #9
                  I would hope and expect AW would reject any budding model that seemed vulnerable at the interviewing stage; it’s an ethical site after-all! Youth is sexy, that is why nearly all the models are in their twenties or thirties, in straight, gay and bi-sexual porn, although there is a niche market for Mature. This is probably because moving image porn is predominately visual with the emphasis on the fit, healthy body (again there is all different types of fetishes out there, but I’m talking about the mainstream.) This is not an argument about varied body shapes, body hair or natural versus artificial, just the fact that youth and healthiness are a turn-on and to masturbate or watch with a partner is the main reason you look at porn.

                  The virginal, innocent teen fetish does worry me a bit I have to confess. I would not go as far as to say it’s similar to child-porn (which should not be called child porn but child abuse full-stop) but the emphasis on certain child-like imagery (innocence, infantile clothing, lollypops, etc) can be unsettling. If you are turned on by this it does not make you a paedophile though, any more than a rape fantasy makes you a rapist or want to be raped in real life. Sexual fantasies are a very weird thing after-all.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by JacksonP49 View Post
                    Originally posted by AarontheMoor View Post
                    > I doubt that this thread will remain in existence for very long. About another 12 hours max, I'd say.
                    You need to revise your estimate.

                    > all the models (with VERY few exceptions) have done it before and are used to posing nude for porn sites.
                    What's the basis for your assertion? Do you have stats? Just wondering how you would know.

                    > Michelle's website, which is a mess
                    lightsouthern.com, right? Seems pretty sharp to me.

                    > A pity, but casting innocent girls might be quite a big and difficult job.
                    It's a nice fantasy to assume that porn models aren't sexually active, or to believe that they're innocents who have made a momentary decision to go from cloistered home schooling to spreading their legs just for you. I guess that's what drives the whole pigtails, candy, short kilt fetish. But it doesn't seem healthy to me, as it's just a little too close to child porn. Isn't it more of a turn on to watch well educated, confident, sexually aware women who know exactly what they're doing? It is for me.
                    Yes, my guess was wrong. It was based on experience (e.g., seeing the post about Sophie's porn work for other sites deleted the other day only a short time after it appeared), but it was wrong.

                    As for the fact that real first timers are almost non-existent now, that's based on a number of things including personal observation, posts by other members, and posts by the models themselves. There's the occasional one, but they're very rare.

                    Before AW left Australia quite a few of the models were genuine first timers. The number diminished greatly as soon as the site moved to Amsterdam. Whether there would still be genuine first timers in Australia now is debatable, but there certainly aren't many willing to pose for AW in Europe.
                    I was a first-timer! There are loads of girls on the site, there must be more like me. I don't think Yara had done work like this before, even if its something she is interested in doing more of now, and I'd be really surprised if Gala wasn't a first-timer as well. She wasn't shy, but I think that's just her ballsy personality. And didn't Mirai lose her virginity on AW basically? She had to be a first timer.

                    Unless your definition of first-time is someone who has literally never taken a nude photo, in which case, in the age of the naked selfie, you're gonna have to kiss that one good-bye!

                    Comment

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