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    Ideas for a new website

    Hi guys

    At the risk of polarising you all, I thought I'd throw open for discussion an idea that the Team and I have been talking about for a long time now. We'd like to start a new site sometime this year. It would probably be devoted to some kind of "fetish", tho not necessarily a "strong" one.

    It would be different in nature to abbywinters.com, in that it'd not be focused so firmly on "real" girls next door, no makeup, their own clothes (unless there's a lot of demand for it here?).

    Ideas we have tossed around include (but are not limited to):

    Pee
    Lotsa video (multiple angles, very high quality), dedicated scenarios, clothing wetting, public stuff, lighting and production dedicated to highlighting pee stuff.

    Legs / feet / stockings
    This is not a fetish of mine, but I have seen some truly excellent stuff on ATK, and am up for the challenge. Never shot a model in stockings (not worn much here in .au), but i can see the appeal, and the possibilities.

    Nude only
    This site would probably feature more classically "beautiful" models, in very plain, single colour backgrounds, no clothing, just nude. Dunno if I can make a site out of just that, tho.

    Light bondage / restraint
    We're still developing this idea, but it'd feature mostly male-female interaction, probably sex, with a definite dominant person in each shoot (alternating male and female). No tacky whips to dungeon settings, however. More in the vein of the Japanese stuff, in a way.

    Men
    Prolly not going to get much support here, but the gay market seems ripe to me. Similar approach that I take with female models on aw.com, but guys instead of girls.

    Couples
    Girl-girl, boy girl, girl girl boy, girl boy boy, etc. That'd be in addition to the GG content on aw.com. Would prolly have a range of stuff - just naked play, kissing, oral, penetration.

    Public nudity
    This bores me to tears, but lotsa people seem to like it, so maybe I should learn to appreciate it more?

    Models would be shared between aw.com and whatever this new site is, to an extent. Content on aw.com would stay the same. Members of aw.com would get reduced signup rates for the new site (and vice versa). Prising would probably be $20US a month, though I would not mind trying a pay-per-download delivery method (like www.darchives.com).

    Anyway, I am open to ideas! Let me know what you think!

    a

    #2
    My initial thought is that I get a little bit ( well more than a little bit actually )of every thing good here on AW.com
    and so I would think that any new site you got into would have to be even better than what you do here before I would be tempted.
    Pee is good and another theme you could think about is knickers. Yes done to death I know but it is my pet fetish and I do think you could bring another dimension to it.
    Pay per download, well maybe that might be the way to go but I could be wrong on that as well img tag disable, use attachment mgr/system to add images to postshttp://www.abbywinters.com/discus/clipart/happy.gif

    Comment


      #3
      Personally, the peeing one is my favourite, though I've also got an interest in having a couples site too.

      A couples site, especially hardcore, would need to be more expensive monthly, though - double the models, and a much more intimate situation, means higher expenses.

      Comment


        #4
        I think a high quality site with great pee pics would be a winner. Equally, a site with couples would also be excellent. Lots of penetration. After all, that is what it is all about :-)

        Comment


          #5
          Nude Ballroom Dancing! Videos and pics.
          And, what a great opportunity for publicity -- apply to be an Olympic Sport!!!
          I can't decide if the guys should get extra points for an erection, or have points taken off.
          Girl/girl dancing! Boy/boy dancing! Coed line dancing! The possibilities are endless.
          And, how about that nude all-girl band.
          Abby, this isn't just a site, it's a lifestyle!
          I'm in!

          Comment


            #6
            For me, pee shots are not attractive. The only one I really like is Alana with the mirror - that's inspired. Her expression is priceless.

            I would pay (extra) for Abby-style BG stuff. I think that would be fantastic, especially the videos. To fit with the philosophy of aw.com it would have to be genuine, none of this "simulated sex" stuff. I wonder many of Abby's existing models would do BG shoots. I fear that few of them would and that the standard of models willing to do BG shoots may be lower. I have no idea about the quality of men - I'm sure there would be no problem with the quantity of potential male models.

            The ideal for me would be for Abby's models to do BG stuff with their real-life boyfriends, assuming the men are as good-looking as the girls we know and love. I fear that is an unattainable fantasy though.

            In the alternative, I'd look at moving up market and going for a true "art" site. Something that celebrates beautiful women in an artistic but erotic manner. Far fewer, technically perfect, shots per model with the option of purchasing them as fine art prints.

            I don't know the size of that market. It may be too small to be worthwhile.

            Comment


              #7
              Frankly I'd pay extra if you'd leave out the pee scenes.

              I'm not interested in the gay market but a lot of people are. If you took your style in that direction it could work for you.

              I've always enjoyed "here with my boyfriend" scenes, though part of what makes your images cool is the spontenaity of, say, Ally deciding she'd like to try girl-girl even though she stays too shy to open up below the belt. Getting the same effect from sex with established boyfriends might be tough. If you do it don't worry if the guys are gorgeous or plain. Enthusiasm, a sense of humor, and I suppose stamina count for more in BG. If the girl thinks they're good enough they're good enough.

              Bondage would be interesting unless you tried to make it dramatic. Real bondage between real BDSM lovers is hard to make interesting because so much of it is about internal tension and emotional suspension. Not to beat a dead horse but the take a dare scenario would be more fun, especially for some of your more adventurous GG-willing models. "How does this work? How do I look? How far am I willing to go like this?" would be very attractive.

              figleaf

              Comment


                #8
                Public nudity: Jan Vaals style public nudity isn't particularly interesting. Mostly it's just people standing around in front of signs, bus stops, or the local pub and dropping their overcoats for the shot. (Maybe the overcoat coverup is why so many of 'em seem to be shot in cold weather.) And also... in real life sexy people don't stand naked outside libraries, psychos do!

                In real life you might not notice a gal in the park popping open her shorts for her friend... unless the friend has an expensive camera, another guy has a pro-quality video camera, someone else is holding a reflector, a handler is managing soft drinks and paperwork... (And never mind they're all on the clock and first had to drive to the location.) The peekaboo local park shots you've done with Susie and a couple of other models are very cute. But unless the model's full of genuine mischief (and not all of them are) I don't know how far you can get them to go.

                Abby it's hard enough making it look spontaneous indoors in privacy and you're not into flashing. I'm sure there are interested subscribers. Are there enough interested models? And unless you're in Amsterdam where would you go that authorities wouldn't eventually object?

                (Note: Private outside nudity's altogether different. The backyard sprinkler preview was very cute. There are all kinds of backyard shenanegans that people might really do on an unexpected day off. I hope you don't mind doing that.)

                figleaf

                Comment


                  #9
                  eeek, I have let this thread go, some. Sorry.

                  Arsby:
                  ballroom dancing, huh? Prolly not that realistic, but a fun idea alla same. Thanks img tag disable, use attachment mgr/system to add images to postshttp://www.abbywinters.com/discus/clipart/happy.gif

                  Artful:
                  boy-girl stuff... yes, that does seem to be popular. Hard to find models using our current selection process (we'd prolly use gals and their male partners, rather than pair unknowns), but I guess that's part of the challenge.

                  There does not seem to be any common thread on which models we have shot are interested in doing hetro sex on camera - some are gorgy, some are average.


                  re, the art site, I think the market would be too small, tho since I was listed at www.michelle7.com, I have had a few more enquiries for prints (ie, up from 0 per month to two per month). Not worth it, and anyway, I am not that passionate about shooting that genre, sorry.

                  TFL:
                  The pee stuff is pretty popular, so we're unlikely to include less of it on this site, and it may be viable to start another site featuring it. I'll count you out as a member img tag disable, use attachment mgr/system to add images to postshttp://www.abbywinters.com/discus/clipart/happy.gif

                  ACK on your points about shooing an existing couple - you're dead right. And there are risks. A shooter friend of mine described how a 19 year old couple he got in to shoot were HOPELESS - they literally did not know how to have sex. It was a very funny description he gave me, and was probably embellished, but the signed off wondering how teenagers get impregnated at all, if that was anything to go by. He says he tried several times, and gave up shooting hetro entirely.

                  ACK on your dare scenario (GG), I like it.

                  And ACK on your take on public nudity. Arsby sent me a private email that suggested I should not have mentioned not being that excited about it, indeed, that's the LAST thing I should have mentioned. How boring will a site be that I have no interest in?!

                  Thing is, if other people are interested, then I will research it, and apply myself to it, and most likely get interested (if I did not, I'd not make the site)... but i cannot expect anyone here to know that, so I think he has a damn good point.

                  The gal-in-the-park stuff is fun to shoot (there are a few more models coming up like that, actually, Ginny and Kim especially), and I think a valuable addition to abbywinters.com... but I don't think I could make an entire site out of it - and anyway, it'd detract from aw.com, and the point is to create a site that compliments this not, takes away from it.

                  (Your points of the practicalities of shooting in a park are very perceptive!)

                  As the last batch of shoots were in Summer, and we were lucky enough to shoot in a house with a large and secluded backyard, there are lotsa shoots coming up that feature that.

                  abby

                  Comment


                    #10
                    I'd really like to see what you could do with hetero situations. It's gotta be hard to do right because good stuff is very rare. But if you could pull it off it would really be worth it. I agree the best would be mixed people just goofing around instead of trying to be sexy – unless they really can be.

                    Interesting twists:
                    Most women in porn, even on your site, don't get particularly excited. Making it over to orgasm is even less common. Almost every guy in porn is expected to have at least one. What's with that? And despite all that (or because of it?) hardly anyone give a rat's butt about the guy.

                    Suggestions:
                    Most porn fucking is about the guy pretending to be satisfying the woman. She grimaces and rolls her eyes and pretends she's wildly out of control on the end of this guy's mighty scepter or tongue or whatever. When what she's really doing is basically sit-down or bend-over aerobics till the director says 'cut' or the guy loses his woody.

                    Why not turn the tables on your site? Amateur guys are likely to struggle with ejaculation control anyway. Instead of trying to get them through bumpity-bumpity-bumpity intercourse why not get them to play around instead. Make it a game to see how long they both can keep him going, and how close to the edge they can get him before he loses it. Make it ok for him to stop when he gets close. After a while he'll get into the swing of it and maybe go for a while. But most porn sites skip all that. Oh yeah, I remember why. It's called foreplay and porn sites don't get it. They don't even get it for women so why would they get it for men?

                    Challenges (but not show stoppers):
                    1) How do you want to deal with the 'money shot' thing anyway? (In real life what guy wants to stop at the best part, pull out of somewhere warm and friendly, to do something he's been able to do any time he's been alone in your bedroom since you were 14?)

                    2) Unless he's really young, if he does come early he's going to need some recovery time. Everyone's one the clock. What does everyone do, at least till he stops wincing when someone touches his glans? I suppose the next game could be how quickly can you get him back up, but the shoots are going to be a lot less predictable and take a lot longer.

                    Other Miscellaneous Suggestions:
                    - You could do BGG where everybody gets to try something out until his girlfriend reaches her limit with what he's doing she gets the last turn with him.
                    - How about trying a riff where instead of getting your semi-straight models to try girl-girl scenes you ask semi-gay and -lesbian models to try boy-girl together?

                    figleaf

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Boy/Girl stuff seems to be a popular type of porn that people seem to want. We've never had to deal with it before (heck, we're still new to the girl/girl arena) so it's gonna be a challenge just finding a guy who can keep it up on camera, even if it is the girl's boyfriend. And of course, finding someone who isn't plastered all over with tattoos, preferably, which I fear may be all we'll ever get.

                      *sigh*

                      So figleaf, you've got a bunch of suggestions and ideas that are outstandingly great - but I think we should overcome our first challenge initially: i.e. how we're gonna do this!

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Actually your first challenge answering why you want to do it. Besides bringing in more money I mean. (If that's all you wanted you could buy a car dealership or start a psychic hotline or something.)

                        The second challenge is answering what you think Boy/Girl stuff should be in an Abby context. Is maintaining an erection really a problem? Is getting it back up either so hard or so boring that photographing it wouldn't be just as interesting? (By total coincidence, last night a neighbor disclosed that sex has become more interesting for her since her partner's become mildly impotent.) Remember, real sex isn't about fucking like a windup toy.

                        By the way have you tried any shoots yet? If not you should. Are your obstacles real or anticipated?

                        And now for the self seeking part. Would you be willing to your first couple of attempts in the (hypothetical) Abby's Special Interests pages? As long as you didn't promise it was going to be an ongoing deal I don't think anyone would hold it against you. (You'd want to check with Janes and X3 and other review sites first because maybe *they* might, and that might be bad.)

                        Now for the third challenge: Why do you think you need to do enough boy/girl stuff to sustain a whole website? I've encountered some pretty spectacular failures when, say, an extremely successful and very profitable magazine company tried to get into television. They not only failed in television, but the additional overhead and the stress on their creative and executive staff made their bread-and-butter magazine enterprise fell apart. The point is there might be more money in girl/boy, but there's clearly more cost, risk, and hassle.

                        figleaf

                        Comment


                          #13
                          I am absolutely not interested in BG of any type. Your site is at its best when it features extreme closeups of all parts of a girl's anatomy, and to include a guy in any scene would spoil it. There are hundreds of sites with all the BG action you could ever want. I am sick to death of fellatio, cunninlingus, BG intercouse, etc. and really don't want to see some guy's hairy ass blocking my view of the girl (GG is okay. It gives one a choice to look at). I don't have penis envy of any of these "studs", I just am not gay enough to enjoy looking at them (and, quite frankly, wonder about those who do).

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Hiya

                            TFL, why do I want to do it? Well, sure, the money is an issue. aw.com is doing ok now, spuuorting itself, but with it, I have kinda cornered myself into a specific genre, and my creative juices are a-flowin'. If I added more stuff to aw.com that is beyond it's scope, I'd HAVE to raise the sub prices, and that's something that is borderline at the moment. Also, there's the "eggs in one basket" thing.

                            Re, BG sex, yes, I know it's not all about fucking, thanks for the tip img tag disable, use attachment mgr/system to add images to postshttp://www.abbywinters.com/discus/clipart/happy.gif

                            I have some very cool ideas about BG stuff, and we plan on shooting some stuff soon. We'll put samples on the boards, and MAYBE in the Gold section as well. But if we do that, we run a risk (much like this thread, I am beginning to think), of getting people to expect it alla time. Bad. Good point on the review sites, tho.

                            Thing is, the material would not be intended for an aw.com audience, really. Makes sens to go out looking for a NEW audience, right? Hmmm.

                            ACK on your cross media examples... but it's not like we're going into magazine publishing. We know the media well, we know the markets well, we know the models, the technical stuff. Obviously, having different sex partners will add something more challenging, in the same way GG partnering did. And I think we did ok there.

                            Of course, we might be hopless at it. But we'd do 15, 20 shoots before we started the site, and if we are crap at it, well, that's the way it goes. the site would have a higher sub rate, for sure.

                            a

                            Comment


                              #15
                              I'm wholeheartedly for a new site with more pee pics!!! I love pee pics but if you do it PLEASE DO NOT do it like waaaaaaay to fetish like Hustler and others of the ilk do. You know, boots with 7 inch heels, girls in dogcallers, peeing into dog dishes, as much as I love pee pics that just goes to "out there" for me. You don't have to have them as "natural" as with AW but don't go complete fetish and PVC and leather everything please!

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Just keep up the clear real life photos and please Mr. Please get those stubbly armpits~
                                Sweaty too~
                                Stubman

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  A good way to get those stubbly armpits sweaty is with some vigorous bending exercises.
                                  And if she loses control and pees while doing her exercises and showing off those sweaty stubbly armpits, well, that should keep just about everyone happy.

                                  Abby's new site:
                                  SweatyStubblyArmpitBendyPee.com
                                  Has a ring to it.

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    I am wholeheartedly against a new site if it takes away from what I get here as a Gold member.

                                    What I mean is that if AW started an "AW Pee-only" (close to my heart fetish) site, and the Pee content that I get here at the original AW site went away in order to help supply the new site, I wouldn't be happy. We get a decent variety fetish content here: GG, Pee, outdoor and insertions (yawn). I agree with Rainmaker in that only natural pee stuff is interesting to me at all.

                                    As far as BG goes, why on earth would you want to start competing with the 100 million other BG sites on the web? There may be money in it to a point, but you'd be just one more in an endless stream of boring porn. Even if you kept it amateur, there are a bunch of amateur sites out there. And I don't belong to any of them for good reason. I can get tons of BG, amateur, S&M, B&D stuff for free in the dicussion groups.

                                    I also agree with Bornonce, in that I don't want to look past some guy's hairy balls to see a nice pussy. If I want to see balls, I can drop my pants anytime. I certainly don't need to look at some other guy's package.

                                    Also, most BG stuff I've seen falls into two categories as far as the guy goes. He's either lived his entire life in a gym, and looks like a professional weightlifter with a 12" schlong, or (as in most of the amateur sites, including the "here's my boyfriend fucking me" sites) he's either a skilly liitle rodent from down the street, a biker, or totally unskilled. I agree with TFL, too, that seeing some guy jerk off at the moment of truth has no draw whatsoever.

                                    The only thing that I would be interested in would be an amateur GG only site.

                                    As I re-read my post - the message seems to be
                                    1) BG stuff, for the most part, is really boring and tremendously overdone
                                    and most importantly,
                                    2) While I don't really care much about another site, I'd definitely care if the new site meant I'd lose anything from the existing site.
                                    3) While I'm not much interested in a site beyond what I get at AW Gold, I would be interested to see what an Amateur-GG-only site would be like.

                                    Abby and team - good luck with whatever new site you create. I love the work you do now, and I want you to be wildly successful.

                                    Best Regards,

                                    Slipjig

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Hiya SJ

                                      To be honest, I am sick of people accusing me of doing this. Like I said in the initial post, "Content on aw.com would stay the same". I used to be a customer of sites, I know what is foremost in everyone's mind in a discussion like this, and as I hope you'd have read here, I made this site cos I was sick of other sites doing things like this.

                                      So, no, SlipJig, the content on aw.com would not be compromised. I am disappointed you think it would be.

                                      The fact is, I have assembled a great team of people, who at the moment are under-worked. VidDude and Susie are starting full time shortly, we have a big studio, and models knocking down our door wanting to be photographed. However, the recently run survey, on adding two new models a week to the site, was not received very well.

                                      About 40% of people do not agree to the price increase that would be in line with adding two new models a week to the site. From that I can assume that _roughly_ 40% less people would not join the site - ie, signups would be 40% less than they are now. We're not looking at a 40% increase in subscription rates (33%, in fact), so we'd be loosing money for the next few months.

                                      What I expect will happen, is that push will come to shove, and I will HAVE to increase the sub fee. Probably at the start of 2003.

                                      So, with our resources and skills, we probably will open a new site some time soon.

                                      I generally disagree with your comments on boy-girl sex, but it's not looking very likely at this stage, so that's a moot issue.

                                      Thanks for your feedback.

                                      a

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        > About 40% of people do not agree to the price
                                        > increase that would be in line with adding two
                                        > new models a week to the site.

                                        I'd be fascinated to hear the reasons given by the nays. What on earth are they thinking?

                                        Comment


                                          #21
                                          Hi Muggins

                                          Yes, me too. I even said that comments were required on this survey, and it made no difference. Most no's said nothing. Those that did, lessee...:

                                          "I'm not sure what that would take me up to -- I think I'm at $160 a year already. On the other hand, I would like the extra model and, since I'm now employed, I probably wouldn't bolt unless I decide it's time to stop spending my time looking at your delicious models."
                                          This person cannot afford a yearly sub, all at once, but has been with us for a long time. Good point he has.

                                          "i don't know how much comments factor into your poll results; that's something i'd like to poll you on. i tend to add caveats and qualifiers to my answers a lot. i hope you don't just tally up yesses and noes. a) If you did this and i left for any reason, i don't think i'd come back at that rate. This past Sunday marked our one year anniversary, and at $15/month, my present to you was $180. i've come to realize that at my rate of pay i can't keep that up, esp. if i want to explore other sites (i'd probably come back, don't worry). And i couldn't afford to pay all at once to get it over w/ up front. b)My "no" answer is for _me_. If you asked "Should i increase the price", i'd say yes. i want this site to make money and to grow. c)i don't think the extra model is much of an incentive. You do so much already, i doubt people would pay more to get more. They might, however, pay more to keep getting what they are getting."
                                          aw, gee, more good points.

                                          "I can just afford the current subscription rate, but the proposed additional cost would discourage me from subscribing."
                                          Fair enough. This was the most common cited reason for answering "no", but would only account for 5% of the "no" answers.

                                          "I think adding new models isn't worth the price hike, but if you started to include some interactivity - like chat or web cam, then it would be worth the extra."
                                          Again, fair enough (very unlikely to happen, a pet hate of mine - I have gone to a hell of a lot of trouble to get models to post to the 'boards, and no one cares - I am very disappointed about this).

                                          "I am not sure that Quality will follow when more model more often will be added as I already see a tendance notably with the mezzanine section."
                                          Damn, exactly what I was afriad of, with the Mez section. Of course, it's not the case now (I think everyone agrees, models lately are "better" than those of a year ago - if we added more models they'd be the same high quality, there'd just be more of them. I pointed this out many times, but people do not believe me).

                                          "Aussie dollar is already 2 for 1 - would be $40 a month for your Aussie subscribers."
                                          Obviously, this person is very confused, but I don't have the means to remove invalid votes.

                                          "would like to see bigger discount for longer subscription."
                                          Ha, not a chance, pal. The price you're paying now is far and away the cheapest arund, for the amount of original content you get.

                                          "The updates are already a sly way to extend one shoot over several days....a tease that does work to get people to checking back each mon, wed, sat...."
                                          *sigh* another poor, misguided person. Makes me wonder WTF I bother taking pics at all some times.

                                          "Out of my budget. This site costs the same as what is costs to run my car for 14 days."
                                          Er. Ok.

                                          Hey, you asked.

                                          Abby

                                          Comment


                                            #22
                                            I checked out AW because of the content
                                            I joined because of the price advantage over other sites of similar and ,
                                            dare I say it , equal/better content
                                            I stay a member because of the ongoing great content and the ongoing price advantage.
                                            In the event of a price increase to match the other similar sites I will , in all honesty ,
                                            probably leave to check some of them out ( one from your links list in particular Abby )

                                            Comment


                                              #23
                                              I forgot to add :
                                              We have been spoiled rotten really img tag disable, use attachment mgr/system to add images to postshttp://www.abbywinters.com/discus/clipart/happy.gif

                                              Comment


                                                #24
                                                I'd like to put in a comment to hopefully counter the tide of anti-BG sentiment. Having BG content of Abby-esqe quality would be a wonderful thing. I joined AW because of the great picture quality and great models, but I would strongly prefer that BG content was included. I personally skip over the pee photos but I understand that some people like that. My personal favorites are fellatio and cum on faces and breasts. If Abby made a site like that I would be sure to subscribe!
                                                Thanks!

                                                Comment


                                                  #25
                                                  I think maybe you're being overly negative in your interpretation. Cheer up! img tag disable, use attachment mgr/system to add images to postshttp://www.abbywinters.com/discus/clipart/happy.gif

                                                  > [36%] of people do not agree to the price
                                                  > increase that would be in line with adding
                                                  > two new models a week to the site.

                                                  36% of existing members *that responded to the survey* did not agree. I don't know what proportion of your *total membership* this represents, but the ayes, and those who did not submit a response (and so can be assumed not to oppose the increase), constitute a substantial majority. It's likely a significant number of nays would be turned around once they'd been exposed to a couple of two-model weeks.

                                                  > From this, we can broadly say that, if we did
                                                  > up the prices, regardless of the content changes,
                                                  > we'd have 36% less people joining.

                                                  Does the result warrant this conclusion? I doubt many of the nays put themselves in the position of a potential new member when they responded.

                                                  Best wishes.

                                                  Muggins

                                                  Comment


                                                    #26
                                                    A few comments...... keep in mind the three kinds of lies. (lies, damn lies, and statistics. -- B. Disraeli)

                                                    Abby said:
                                                    > Obviously, this person is very confused
                                                    .....and......
                                                    > another poor, misguided person

                                                    .....so if you remove all the confused and misguided No votes, what do the numbers become? Seems you can assume that the no-reason No votes would exist in a similar proportion. Or maybe a greater proportion, considering they couldn't follow the simple direction of leaving a comment. :-)

                                                    Muggins said:
                                                    > those who did not submit a response (and so can be
                                                    > assumed not to oppose the increase), constitute a
                                                    > substantial majority.

                                                    Zoinks. Don't think you can count votes that way..... "everyone who didn't vote would have voted for my side." Considering that 50% turnout is about average for 'Merkin elections, we would have two presidents all the time, since both the Ds and the Rs would have more than 50% of the total vote. :-)

                                                    I'm one of the non-voting members. My answer wasn't on the poll.....there was no "maybe" button. On the one hand, this is the only pay site I belong to, because of the quality and the content. Now that I've been here a while, I would probably pay more for it, but I've got more money than sense. On the other hand, I couldn't answer simply from my present point of view, as Abby said to think of yourself as a new member. At the time I signed up, there was something special about $15 versus the price everyone else in the world was charging. 50 cents a day seems like nothing; that's just one less diet coke from the machine at work.

                                                    On that note..... One can look at other sites to compare prices, but really, for people who have to worry about an extra fiver every month, the competition isn't with other pay sites, its with USENet, which is free for most people. Or with free porn web sites. Or, its with the cost of a public Usenet server, which has more porn and mp3s and warez and everything else than one person could ever download, for $10 or so per month. Or its with the cost of broadband versus dial up. Marginal Utility, as my old Economics prof said.

                                                    Anyone who has a set monthly porn budget or basically unlimited funds or something like that probably won't be turned off by five more dollars. It isn't like you could join another site elsewhere for the difference. For most folk, though, I think twenty dollars a month is pretty significant, when you compare it to the monthly cost of water or electricity or food or maintaining a car..... which is where I think random comment number nine was coming from. To make a long story short, porn is a luxury, not a necessity. I just don't think there are many people who have infinite money for luxuries; they have to put aside necessities for them. All the quality content in the world won't change the fact that some people just will not pay twenty bucks a month for something they will happily pay fifteen for.

                                                    In the end, polls like this, and the few sparse comments from us in the peanut gallery here on the boards, are all the info the site has to go on. Maybe the poll was off by a factor of two, and only 20% of the members would be miffed. Maybe all the "maybes" like me should be Yes votes. But maybe its off in the other direction, or the maybes are No-s. The votes are in, now its just up to the folks in Florida to decide how to count them.

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                                                      #27
                                                      Just one final thought, as though the previous ramble was not long enough.

                                                      What percentage of us have ponied up the cash for Gold access? Reckon that would be a fair estimate of how many folk are willing to pay more to get more.

                                                      Comment


                                                        #28
                                                        > Zoinks. Don't think you can count votes that
                                                        > way..... "everyone who didn't vote would have
                                                        > voted for my side."

                                                        You misrepresent me. I clearly stated that those who did not submit a response can be assumed *not to oppose* the increase. You yourself choose not to vote (there was no "undecided" option), so for the purposes of this simple poll, Abby can only assume that you would not object to the proposition.

                                                        We're not voting in a new government here.

                                                        http://www.abbywinters.com/gold/index.htm

                                                        > What percentage of us have ponied up the cash for Gold access?

                                                        "Around 80%."

                                                        Comment


                                                          #29
                                                          My apology to Abby...

                                                          Sorry about that. Yes, you have mentioned several times that the quality and quantity of the AW site would either remain the same or increase. As I re-read my post, it doesn't come off that well. It's one of those things - when you have something great, you protect it jealously!

                                                          I guess a better way to express it would be, "Hey, since you say my content won't suffer, I think you should create whatever other specialized site you think would be profitable. I am very satisfied with the current site, so unless it were a GG only site with the same look and feel of the original, I would stick with what I have. One is all I am interested in paying for, really. Adding another pay site to my current investment wouldn't happen, and unless it were AWGG.com, I wouldn't have a reason to switch."

                                                          I hope that comes across better, and I wish you the best. For now - I'm sitting tight.

                                                          I agree with Muggins and Kumaraguy - img tag disable, use attachment mgr/system to add images to postshttp://www.abbywinters.com/discus/clipart/happy.gif you've been spoiling us, and cheer up - we're all happy to be here...

                                                          Slipjig (a big fan)

                                                          Comment


                                                            #30
                                                            > You misrepresent me.

                                                            Very sorry, no offense intended.

                                                            > I clearly stated that those who did not submit a
                                                            > response can be assumed *not to oppose* the increase.

                                                            However, that is exactly what I was trying to say. It is just as correct to say that they are all "not in favor" of the increase. The reality, of course, is somewhere in between.

                                                            A real world example from a former employer of mine..... the airline industry wants good info on what they're doing to their customers. For instance, if a customer is bumped from a flight, or has a flight cancelled, they want to be able to offer that customer something.....such as frequent flier miles or a first-class upgrade.....while they are still in the terminal or on the plane. Why? A poll of former fliers on the airline showed that 90% of the ones who were hit by overbookings or canceled or delayed flights didn't complain.... they didn't give us a chance to make things right. Had they spoken up, they would have gotten some measure of satisfaction from us. But, they just quietly switched to other airlines in the future. The silent majority, 90%, wouldn't speak up for what they wanted....they just walked.

                                                            I say this because.....I like this site. I'd hate to see it have the same sort of difficulty. Assuming the silent majority will pay extra money just because they didn't speak up.... well, it goes against my life experience.

                                                            Though the 80% with gold access probably means the silent folk are tending more towards your interpretation than mine. :-)

                                                            > We're not voting in a new government here.

                                                            No, its much more serious than that. :-) ....actually, to Abby, it probably is. This is her life's work.

                                                            Again.....no offense intended.....just info. I think we are on the same side in this discussion, really.....I would like to see more here. But, looking back to when I subscribed, I might not have signed up if it had been more expensive. As I said above, it can be hard to pay for porn when there is terabytes of free stuff out there. Just the pictures on the guest page here weren't enough, either.....I had looked at this site sometime in 2000, and did not subscribe then. It was Arsby's USEnet posts that showed me the sort of -series- of pictures that were here and pushed me into giving it a chance.

                                                            .....and to put in my two cents on the original question for this discussion..... I probably would not subscribe to a specific fetish site. I like variety. I might look at a b/g site or a bondage site, just because there would still be good variety. Only stockings or only public nudity I wouldn't be interested in.....and I am on Leaf's side about the pee pictures.....not my thing at all.

                                                            Comment

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