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Thread: Object Insertions

  1. #1
    Mistress of the Boards Posting tornado renae_d's Avatar
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    Object Insertions

    Hey guys!

    This topic has come up a few times on threads about specific shoots, but I think it would be better to discuss the issue in a devoted thread, rather than drag in a specific model/shoot/photographer. It's obviously a site-wide policy to create images like these, so makes sense to discuss it more generally.

    So object insertions! There's even a fetish category devoted to it! In the fetish it refers to sticking any random object inside oneself, but there's also the tag 'insertions' which would include fingers too. These are the most explicit shoots on the site.

    I see a lot of people complaining about models sticking too many nonsexual objects in themselves.

    Would you rather see explicit shoots that only show girls putting their fingers or sex toys inside them?

    Do you not like seeing girls put anything in there (but would still like to see them orgasm through clitoral stimulation)?

    Do you just prefer less explicit shoots? Maybe you would like the site to make sure to create less explicit shoots of all the models, so you don't feel like you're missing out? Or maybe you'd like more obvious labeling on how explicit a solo shoot will be before you click it (and get disappointed)? Or maybe you'd like solo shoot photo sets split up into more and less explicit groupings?

    Anyway, just throwing out ideas to see what people are really wanting. Obviously they're not going to stop creating photos like this - they get made for a reason, and we can assume some people really like them.

    Interested to hear what you think!

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    Okay, Renae, here are my thoughts.

    First and foremost, I think you have to distinguish between stills and videos. Very different considerations apply to them.

    First of all, the stills. These always appear before the videos, and they’re what the members see first. My remarks about insertions, whether fingers, dildoes or random objects, really apply mainly to the stills. IMHO the main point of stills is to give us all a really good look at the model. Stills always take the basic form of a strip and then a detailed examination, with the intimacy of the examination depending on what the model is prepared to do. I like both these parts to be done with as little artifice as possible. My dislike of insertions comes from the simple fact that if the model is stuffing something into herself then we can’t see her pussy, to put it bluntly. The same applies to playing with different items of clothing and covering various parts of the body: it all distracts from the whole purpose of the shoot. And my clear preference is for the great majority of shots to show her face, with her looking into the camera, acknowledging its presence and the members’ presence as well. I don’t regard a model as simply a collection of body parts, and I thank the gods that the site seems to have got over its obsession, which lasted for the first half of its existence, with multiple super closeup shots of pink holes. Have a look at any explicit solo from pre-2010 and you’ll see what I mean.

    As for the videos, completely different considerations apply. There are two main components of a video: what the model says and what she does. The doing part consists of a strip and then a show and maybe masturbation. If she’s going to masturbate, I don’t much care what she does it with; the only thing I care about is whether it’s genuine, which I think is usually possible to tell and certainly does not depend on the amount of noise she makes. (In fact usually the more noise she makes, the less convincing it is.)

    As for what the model says, there’s always the stuff about what she does and doesn’t like sexually, which I don’t find exciting although sometimes (rarely) it’s interesting. That aside, I usually find the talking incredibly boring. I really am not interested in how creative or sensitive the model thinks she is. I would far rather hear about where she’s from, what she’s doing in life, what her interests are and how she occupies herself in her spare time, and most of all why she decided to do porn modelling and whether she’s done it or anything similar (stripping, etc) before, and how she feels about it. The models often used to talk about those things (I’m talking about the Australian days) but they virtually never do now.

    I did enjoy Mille’s video btw because she actually is a chef and she told us about that, and the glamour/semi burlesque thing was fun.

    So that’s my two cents’ worth.

  3. #3
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    I've probably posted my opinion on this topic too many times already but I will take one more crack at it. What I haven't liked about many of the stills shoots in recent years are there are too many shoots which are made up of almost exclusively explicit posing and are focused primarily on what is between the model's legs. Shoots often fall into a pattern of a sequence of explicit shots (vaginal closeups, finger insertions, object insertions etc) followed by the model shifting positions for another sequence of explicit shots, rinse and repeat to the end of the shoot. This shooting style is typical of what you see on more mainstream pornography sites and is a distinct departure from the more unique style Abby Winters used to have.

    What I think worked about the shooting style in many of the older shoots are some of the things Jackson commented about above. Even in the explicit shoots there was a much more diverse collection of poses, including full body poses and poses focused more on the model's face and the curves of her entire body than just on what is between her legs (this shoot of Kate E is a great example). This shooting style gave you a real sense of the model's personality and I found it to be much more erotic than a parade of explicit close ups.

    On a more positive note Mille's shoot (and a number of recent shoots in the past year) was a welcome return to the spirit of the shooting style of the older shoots. There were some gorgeous photos of her particularly in the first half of the shoot, it was only towards the end that it started to devolve a bit into sequences of explicit shots and insertions. I would love to see more shoots shot in a similar style to this one.

    One last thought: I'm probably in the minority here as someone who loves soft posing the most and would be perfectly happy if there was no explicit posing at all. Camilla's shoot from earlier this year was spectacular, I would love to see shoots like this one with all soft posing more often (and thank you for the ones that have been included this year). For the models who do multiple shoots for the site it would be great if every model could do one soft shoot.

    Anyways, sorry to go on at length again. Thanks for listening!

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    I rarely look at the stills now, although I used to. I think Trebor and Jacksonpe49 are on the whole correct-most of them are too explicit for my tastes and conform to today's porno formula. Ideally I would like them to be as the photo spreads in classic soft-core magazines of the 70's used to be or like my small collection of coffee-table books of arty nude and erotic photos and paintings. Faces are very important and so is clothing, as well as lighting, background-more cheeky smiles, sexy clothing, curvy breasts and rounded bums, less wide open orifices, spread-open arseholes and giant dildo insertions. Maybe AW could have a separate stills section with selected models that are soft-core and a bit arty (but not too much that they lose their naturalness)

    With the videos it's a different story. I think these are the main course for most members (it is for me!) This is where the serious action of pleasuring yourself comes in, so a strong explicit content has to be present. (This is not to say the few soft-core videos AW does are not sexy, though) But this certainly does not mean it has to be like bog-standard porn. With AW you can tell the models are enjoying themselves and getting off on the experience which feeds back into the viewers erotic enjoyment. If a model likes to use didoes or experiment with vegetables then using them in her video is more then just OK! Also with AW there is a slow, sensuous build to the explicit insertions. I like to know all about the model as well, what she is interested in, her likes and dislikes, her sexual experiences, her fantasies, how she turns on her partner, etc, so talking in videos is good! (Not so keen on all the Yoga positions and flexibly aerobics though-but that's just me) Most of the videos are amazing but that does not mean there is not room for improvement.-I would like to see more concentration on faces for instance and looking straight at the camera!

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    Just a couple of quick points. First, it seems that the members who posted after me got the impression that I’m not a fan of explicit shoots. I must have expressed myself badly because that’s not correct. I like to see as much of the model as she is prepared to show! Explicit is good! My point was, don’t ruin the explicit stills by spoiling the view with fingers and random objects, and once the model has taken all her clothes off, don’t make her put various items of clothing back on.

    And we are all definitely agreed that looking into the camera and smiling is good.

    Brina’s Stills have just gone live. They’re great! Exactly what they ought to be. The full set is a bit long (220 shots), but the Best Of (85 shots) can’t be faulted. Well done Brina and Hermann!

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    Mistress of the Boards Posting tornado renae_d's Avatar
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    Its interesting how most of you seem to want something different from videos and stills. As far as I know, the stills try to match up with video as much as possible, but maybe a different approach would be better!

    Jackson - there is more than one kind of explicit shoot, one includes a model putting something inside herself, the other does not. So, at least when it comes to stills, you prefer the latter. What doesn't exist, are shoots with the mismatch between stills and video. I wonder if it is something Garion has considered.

    Also, I do know what you mean about the early shoots - working on fetishes I dug through many old shoots, and I have to agree with you on that. There are so many imperceptibly different shots, you could make a pussy flip book! (Now that would make an interesting coffee table book!)

    Trebor - it sounds like you prefer the nude only and maybe casual open leg (but not wide open) shoots. They certainly exist on the site. Would you find it more helpful if it were easier to search for just those shoots? From what I can tell, there isn't an easy way to do this currently. Alternatively, would you like it if more explicit photo sets were split up by explicitness (but the number of shots didn't change)?

    George - to expound upon what you said about concentrating more on faces, I have to agree with you there. I think there is something so sexy about face close-ups. I think its because when you are intimate with someone, you often are look at their face from very close, so close you might not even be able to see their whole face, so it reminds me of that. That is my two cents though!

    Now that the weekend is ending, hopefully Garion and/or Masie will give some input. I certainly don't have any experience or authority over these things!

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    Fair enough, Renae. I know there are members who like insertions and I’m not totally against them myself. I guess there are two things about them. One is that in some shoots the model begins inserting things as soon as she’s got naked, so that we don’t get a chance to enjoy her body just naked. Mille’s shoot is like that. If there are to be insertions, there should be a healthy number of non-insertion shots before they start. The second thing is that we went through a phase where the models were inserting one random object after another, which is just silly. There was one not so long ago where I counted 8 different objects being put in there!! It looked like a circus act to be honest. Remember I’m talking about stills primarily.

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    Quote Originally Posted by renae_d View Post
    Trebor - it sounds like you prefer the nude only and maybe casual open leg (but not wide open) shoots. They certainly exist on the site. Would you find it more helpful if it were easier to search for just those shoots? From what I can tell, there isn't an easy way to do this currently. Alternatively, would you like it if more explicit photo sets were split up by explicitness (but the number of shots didn't change)?
    Hi Renae, thanks for your replies and your follow up questions. The nude only shoots are very easy to find through the tagging feature, the staff does an excellent job in tagging all of the shoots when they are initially released.

    I think the main issue for me is with the solo shoots there seems to be significantly less nude only shoots being shot in recent years. Prior to 2011 in particular nude only shoots were a regular part of the site, recently they are only being shot occasionally (and the ones that are being shot are excellent and every bit as good as the older shoots.). I would just love to see nude only shoots a little more often if possible.

    A secondary issue is I think with a lot of the older shoots even the explicit shoots had a fair amount of soft posing within them. If you look at Kate E's shoot I linked above there are sequences of explicit closeups (excluding the pee sequence which was a flip book kind of effect that is no longer done) but there are also a lot of shots with soft posing of her fully naked. With many of the shoots in recent years it seems like after the model is naked the rest of the shoot is almost all explicit posing sequences. I would love it if these sequences could be broken up with a few more soft poses in between.

    One last general comment: as others have noted I think masturbation and insertions are much better suited for the videos than they are in the stills content (the videos for both solo and girl-girl shoots are always excellent). I'm probably in the minority again where I tend to spend most of my time looking at stills content over video (though again the videos are great).

    Thanks again for the time!

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    Soft posing is soo sexy! I think Miss Zane does a wonderful job with this style of posing. Actually, her soft look has made me develop a bit of a crush...
    On the topic of object insertions -- Am I the only one who is INTO this? Take a look at my shoot with Layla K, & you will see us using our hair curlers and brush as toys. While it is not something I would have normally tried, neither is lesbian sex! However, I had a great time & I think it felt really good.

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    I’ve just watched Brina’s video and it illustrates everything I’ve said above. Brina is absolutely gorgeous: she has beautiful skin, really beautiful features and a fabulous young body. And she talks a lot about her body and her sexuality, she shows us every bit of herself and she masturbates to orgasm (not a terribly convincing one though, I must say).

    But who is she? Her accent suggests she’s American, but east coast? West coast? Where’s she from? Was the video shot in the US or somewhere else? What does she do? Is she a student? If so, what is she studying? What’s she interested in? Does she work? At what? Why has she decided to do a porn shoot? Is this her first? How does she feel about taking her clothes of and opening herself up to the camera? She’s just presented as a generic pretty girl who’s a sexual being but nothing else.

    Personally I think it’s disrespectful to present her as nothing more than that. She’s a human being with a life and a history and hopes and expectations. Sure, it’s a porn shoot, but I’d like to know something about this young woman who has decided to do porn

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    Trebor - the thing about nude only shoots is that they aren't paid as highly as explicit shoots (understandably!) For some models, it maybe it isn't worth their time and hassle to do a shoot for less, especially if they have no problem doing a more explicit shoot. That's probably the reason you see less of them. I can't really think of any way around that - except to include more of the kind of shots you like in the more explicit shoots. Might be something to consider!

    Kayla J - that's really interesting! I can see it being well suited to a girl-girl shoot. I personally am not too big on putting stuff inside me as a general rule, especially my vagina.

    Jackson - its interesting that you thought Brina was American. I assumed you were American, but now I think maybe not? Curious! Anyway, her english is quite good and is American style, but she is Serbian, which you can see in the tag on her shoot. Also kinda weird that you thought her orgasm was unconvincing - if you look carefully you can actually see her pussy spasming/contracting from the orgasm. That's an orgasm without even a hint of a doubt.

    Anyway, its possible that she didn't want to talk about some of those topics you mentioned. While I can't personally relate, a lot of the models don't want to talk about themselves or their lives. I guess its about keeping an emotional distance from their real personal lives, and this public version of themselves they are putting out there. They would rather talk about sexual things because it is part of the sexual person they are putting out there. I don't know if I'm explaining that well, hope you get what I mean. You'd be surprised at how many models are most apprehensive about doing the video talking portion of the shoot.

    I also think if they asked every model why they decided to do porn, and how they feel about exposing themselves to the camera, you'd get a ton of very similar answers and this would get repetitive and boring pretty fast.

    As for where are they from, what do they do, what are their interests, I know we hear about that in many shoots. I watch the first several minutes of all the new model solos and their awash with the various hobbies, interests, and studies of the models. Where they live is often tagged in the shoot (unless they request otherwise) and you're not going to have models narrow it down to city for privacy reasons.

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    Great response, Renae, and thanks for taking the trouble.

    As for Brina’s shoot, Serbian origin makes sense but I would guess she’s spent a lot of time in the US to speak English that fluently and with that accent. I’m Australian myself and quite interested in language. I’ll have another look at the video. Vaginal contractions are very sexy!

    What you say about maybe she didn’t want to talk about her life may be correct, but I don’t think most models would mind. I’ve seen shoots from the past on this site, and they still happen on this site once in a while, and certainly I’ve seen first-time models on other sites who don’t seem to have any trouble saying they’re from Manchester or Seattle or wherever and they work as a nurse or a nail technician or whatever. It seems to be a deliberate policy of AW not to talk about those things, and to have the model talk about nothing but her sex life. I’m sure some members find that stuff fascinating but I just find it boring. As for why they decided to do porn, well it’s certainly no more boring than hearing that she’s been shaving her pussy since she was 15.

    The way I look at it is this. If you meet someone at a party or some social situation, the first things you ask are, Are you from around here, and What do you do for a living, and What do you do in your spare time? And if.the person says that she does porn modelling, the first things you would ask are, How did you get into that, and, What’s it like?

    Anyway. I’ve said all this before and nothing changes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by renae_d View Post
    Trebor - the thing about nude only shoots is that they aren't paid as highly as explicit shoots (understandably!) For some models, it maybe it isn't worth their time and hassle to do a shoot for less, especially if they have no problem doing a more explicit shoot. That's probably the reason you see less of them. I can't really think of any way around that - except to include more of the kind of shots you like in the more explicit shoots. Might be something to consider!
    you could perhaps shoot a nude-only shoot AND an explicit shoot when a model is around for shooting anyway? Or indeed expand the explicit shoots a bit in 'time' so to speak and make the nude-only part of those a bit longer, if that made sense ?

    Or do a group nude-only-shoot ('tier1' what are those called nowadays?) .. I doubt anybody would object to one of those

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    Just watched Brina's video and I loved it! Maybe if she does another shoot (I hope so) and she wants to, she could talk more about her non-sexual life, etc. I would think most if not all AW models are very sexually adventurous and active women who like to be looked at (and are turned on by the thought of being watched) by an anonymous audience. What better motivation is there to do some porno stuff in a safe, pro-female environment like AW? (and they get paid for the experience) Nearly all AW members are members of AW because they want to get sexual enjoyment (usually by masturbation if solo or as warm-up for sex if a couple) by looking at (and listening to-sound is important) ethical, pro-women, well-made and ethical erotica/porn.

    Also I think Frans ideas are excellent.

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    I can understand some members’ preference for nude-only shoots, but not so much when the model also does more explicit shoots. Way back when AW was in Australia there seemed to be a never-ending supply of amateur girls who were willing to strip off and be photographed, many of whom had never done anything similar before and never did it again. There were 3 new models every week in those days, and many of them were only willing to do closed leg nudity. (It always surprised me though how many of these completely inexperienced girls would do explicit shoots.)

    Since the move to Amsterdam that supply of true once-only amateur models has largely dried up, and many of the models now — not all of them — have had experience on other sites, and most are happy to do explicit shoots. It would seem a bit artificial to me if a model who was quite happy to be explicit did a nude only shoot.

    Just by coincidence, this week’s new model, Celine, is nude only.

  16. #16
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    I think part of the change is cultural and technological. I think people are much more cognizant of how what they do on the internet can follow them for the rest of their lives. The overlap of girls who are not ok doing explicit shoots but ok appearing on a website which is pornographic is naturally going to be small. I think we're also very close to the technical capability of sticking a photo of person's face in google and finding all the other photos of them on the internet. Once that's a thing using a pseudonym will become pretty meaningless. As for experience, now there's the ubiquitousness of nude selfies, etc. Is anyone every truly unexperienced anymore? I'm probably about as young as you can be and still remember not wanting to take sexy photos with your camera because you'd have to get them developed at the photo counter. In many ways, the changes you see in the site are not the result of policy changes, but simply how the passage of time inexorably changes things.

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    I think you’ve probably got it pretty right there, Renae, and very nicely explained too. But I also think there might be a difference between the scene in Europe and that in Australia. I remember well when AW made the move in 2010, and the supply of new models dried up overnight. If the explanation were purely the increasing sophistication of young girls, I’d expect it to take effect over a period of time. It’s a large part of it though, I’m sure. We do still get the occasional girl who does one nude only solo and nothing more, but they’re pretty rare now. Mostly I think it’s as you say: if a woman has decided that she’s prepared to appear on a porn site at all, she’s 9 times out of 10 prepared to go the whole way.

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